NQP time? [Archive] - SOCNET: The Special Operations Community Network

Scout

29 May 2000, 23:52

Hi,

Since no one else has answered, I'll take a shot at it. I can only tell you what NQP at B/1/20th was like when I looked at doing the program last year. If you joing the unit from another unit, you trained with the NQPs until you could achieve 80% on all the events on the APTF (you took the APFT EVERY month at drill), and then, you had to maintain or improve that score for 3 months after. so, if you come to the unit in good shape, you could theoretically be heading to SFAS after 4 months. After you're selected, you'd come back until a slot opened for your 18 series MOS. But B/1/20th's NQP has been moved over to HHC/1/20th, so things may have changed. And other BNs may be different.

Scout

Snake

30 May 2000, 02:02

But first..
..OSUT. Correct?

Snake
25th ID(L)

Scout

30 May 2000, 13:13

Snake,

I was talking about transferring to NQP from another unit such as some of the guys on the GuardNet are doing. If you're just enlisting and want to go SF, there's always the REP-63 program that'll send a soldier through OSUT, Airborne, PLDC, Pre-Selection, SFAS, and SFQC. Though this works better if you're older--the instructors at Q hate REP-63 guys!

Scout
SOTA, 1/20th SFG(A)

Snake

30 May 2000, 18:35

Scout,
so they keep you in the NQP for a few months. Once they're sure of you, they pipeline you theough -all- those schools,
-at once-? That's an awful long time at Benning.....

Snake
25th ID(L)

Scout

30 May 2000, 18:50

Snake,

If you're a civilian with not prior service, you can enlist in the REP-63 program, where they'll send you to OSUT and Airborne at Benning, PLDC probably at Benning, then pre-Selection, Selection at Bragg. then, if you're selected, its back home a couple months till a slot opens up, then back to Bragg for SFQC, then language if not already fluent, and I think SERE. All total, its a year and a half or 2 years, if you pass everything first try--longer for comm and medics.

If you've already been through IET, its a few months, then Selection, back home til la slot opens, SFQC, Language, maybe SERE. If you're not airborne qualified, you'll get that, too.

Disclaimer: A couple guys I know are doing the REP-63, so that info is about 2 weeks old. The rest of my NQP intel is about a year old and 1/20th specific. I am not Special Forces (that'll be next hitch), I've just joined a STOA on 1/20ths MID. If I've misspoken, feel free to correct me.

Snake

30 May 2000, 20:16

Hmm,
I've got a buddy whose kid brother is starting college in Tampa, and is looking to involve himself in something like this. Isnt there a Company of the 20th in Central FL? What are the units looking for, in terms of recruits for the Rep-63? APFT score,
ASVAB, that sort of thing.
Also, do they pre-train the kids prior to sending them to Benning? And lastly, whats pre-selection?

Snake
25th ID(L)

Michael Robertson Moore

30 May 2000, 21:02

Scout -

Is REP-63 through the NG or Regular Army?

E19

30 May 2000, 21:18

Snake,

There's part of the 20th located in Brooksville which north of Tampa.

MRM,

REP-63 is through the NG. I did the REP-63
gig back in 66/67.

RKW

30 May 2000, 22:31

Hi guys,
Im looking at something similar to Snake's brother, although I plan on enlisting first in a LRSU here in Iowa then going off to college, and if I get the chance try to take off a year and go through SF training. My question is:
Is this a good idea at all since I plan turning active duty later on?
Should I go to college right away and hope to get my chance during college, or should I wait a year, during which I would attend SFAS, the Q Course, Language Training, etc...?

Thanks again for any help you can give,
RKW

cecil18

30 May 2000, 23:46

Snake,
Quote:
"I've got a buddy whose kid brother is starting college in Tampa, and is looking to
involve himself in something like this. Isnt there a Company of the 20th in Central FL?"

I started in B/3/20 as an NQP and went on to get Q'ed, all of this before 1997 when they transfered our guidon to Virginia. The company in Brookesville (45 min. north of Tampa) was redesignated as Det-1 C/3/20th SFG(A), with the unit in Ft. Lauderdale becoming C(-) 3/20th SFG(A). There is also A/3/20th SFG(A) in Ocala, FL.(90 min North of Tampa; 30 min. south of Gainesville. If you would like, e-mail me and I can pass a number onto you for your friend or have him e-mail me and I can pass it to him directly, I am still in contact with the TNG NCO in Brookesville on a regular basis. I did college and SFAS, Q, and language while juggling college at Univ. of Florida.

Qoute:
"What are the units looking for, in terms of recruits for the Rep-63?"

In the Rep-63 case he should be a little older than your average out of high school enlistee, the cadre have a strong tendancy on frowning on 17-21 yr olds (inexeprience and immaturity), and an ability to pass the APFT higher than the normal 70% standards (ideally 80% or greater is a good indicator for physical ability) based on the 17-21 year old standards for the Army.

Quote:
"ASVAB"

I can't exaclty remember on the break down on the apptitude scores, but they should all be over 110 minimum (these may have been dropped to entice enlistment, that's another thread in itself)

Quote:
"do they pre-train the kids prior to sending them to Benning?"

If they are a Rep 63, no off to Basic, AIT, Airborne, PLDC, SFAS, yata, yata , yata. they may change the order of PLDC and SFAS.

If they are prior service they are placed into and NQP (non-qualified personnel) program and begin a train-up program geared to assist/teach them on SUT and Land Nav. We stress a vigourous PT program since that is one of the primary tools we use to seperate the posers from the achievers. If they do not get their PT up to a certian point or show no improvement over say a 3-4 month period, they are transfered to another unit to make room for those that are imporving or meet the requirements to try SFAS. We do teach and advise on how to train (can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink).

Qoute:
"And lastly, whats pre-selection?"

A pre-selection may/could be a two week period (usually during an AT- annual training ) where we asses individuals on SUT and Land Nav intensely (after lessons), it also entails alot of SMOKIN PT, long runs, swims, etc.

I hope this answers your questions. By the way Snake did you ever see the post on April 29th in regards to hand rehab you had asked about a while back?

-Cecil

[This message has been edited by cecil18 (edited 05-30-2000).]

OldSFer

30 May 2000, 23:56

RKW,

Don't put off college. It will take a lot more than a year of active duty to complete all the the SF training. Another thing to remember is if you intend to go AD after college as an officer the you would have to go back to SFQC to qualify as an 18A.

E19,

Who was the toughest SOB instructor when you went through REP? LOL

[This message has been edited by OldSFer (edited 05-31-2000).]

Snake

31 May 2000, 00:07

Cecil,
Thanks for the data on the 20th. And, yeah, I passed on the info you posted about rehabing. Thanks.
Question: The Rep-63's go to -Infantry-OSUT, at Benning, correct? Then straight through to SFAS. Completing SFAS, you still need to go home and wait for a slot at Q, right? What 18-series MOS's are they short of down there? Also, what's the 20th Group's AO? Europe, or Centro? What language would he study, and how long is the Language school? Finally, can he go through ROTC while being in the 20th?

Thanks for you help,

Snake
25th ID(L)

cecil18

31 May 2000, 15:42

Snake,

Glad you got the information from the earlier post.

Now to answer your questions to the best of my knowledge.

If you come into an SF Guard unit as a Rep 63 you enter into a pipe line so to say. Alot is depnedent on the MOS you enlist as (i.e.-18B=11B, 18C=12B engineer MOS, 18D=91A/B, 18E=a commo MOS that I am not sure of). They all would go off to the basic tng and then on to their respective intro level MOS's, once done with AIT I think they all go to Airborne school at Benning then either to SFAS at Bragg or to PLDC possibly (I am not sure on the order of these last two it changes occasionally). Once they pass SFAS they usually are kept on AD until their the next school date starts. If they are a non-select they may be kept on AD to go back to the next SFAS class or sent back to home unit to recoup and come back at a late date.

The MOS's needed are the same on AD 18D and 18E are always critical for us. the 18B and 18C are at good levels in the Battalion. the great thing about the SF Guard is we have no problem with funding when it comes to sending a guy off to get a sencond MOS if they want to go (i.e.- 18B wants to go to 18D). Alot of guys in college spend their summers going off to other schools too.

As for our AO in 3rd Battalion, we have the Carribean, we had Central and South America, but were retasked last year to ease 3rd Groups taskings. I can not speak 100% on 1st and 2nd Battalion, but I think the Battalion in Alabama is working in Central and South America still, as for the Battalion in Mississippi I do not know, sorry.

The language school lasts for 4 months when I went and I think it is now 6 months long now at Bragg. Our AO is concerned with Spanish, French and English.

And for your last question, yes he can be in ROTC and be in an SF Guard unit, I think the program is reffered to as SMP (simultaneous membership program). I would advise him to go and get Qualified as an NCO and then run the ROTC route because the state of Florida has some outstanding programs ($) for its members who are going to college, also (it applies only to state University's and community colleges, NO PRIVATE INSTITUTIONS LIKE UNIV. OF TAMPA OR UNIV OF MIAMI), if you need more info let me know. Being Qualified prior to going to ROTC will help alot with the course work and also you will have the unmentioned respect of NCO's when they realize that you were enlisted prior to commision (that applies if said individual is squared away and not a dirt bag).

I hope I have been of help. Let me know if there is anything I can do to help the chap in Tampa.

-Cecil

[This message has been edited by cecil18 (edited 05-31-2000).]

[This message has been edited by cecil18 (edited 05-31-2000).]

E19

31 May 2000, 20:12

Cecil,

If you sign up REP-63 and want to be (for example)an 18E they send you to a 05B (radio-op.) course before SFAS and then to the Q on a 18E commo platform? In my opinion that would be a waste of time and money. It would make more sense to send you through AIT as an 11B/? or 12B or even 91a/b for example. That way you would have more skills in your ruck when you get back to GRP. After all, in SF cross-training is the name of the game.

Snake

31 May 2000, 21:24

Guys,
If your in the SMP with a Guard SF unit, how do they handle ROTC Advanced Camp? I mean, do you get excused from drill to attend? Also, how long are the "average" operational 20th SFG deployments? Plus, do you have any choice in CMF 18-series MOS? Or do they assign one to you based on -Unit- needs? As in, Steven (Thats my buddy's kid brother)walks into the B/3/20th armory, and -really- wants to be an 18B or 18C. Will they accept that, or just say " Delta or Echo, take it or leave it"? Lastly, is there a contact # for their Armory in Brooksville(?), or should I just have him call the 20th's HHC in Alabama?

Wish there was one in North Mississippi.....heh, even then, the Wife probably wouldnt let me go.
If I dont graduate and get a commission at the same time as her, she'll -never- let me hear the end of it.....and she's 20 credits ahead of me..

Snake
25th ID(L)
And thanks fer the info guys.
I think Steven might just be
ringing them in August.

abaustin

31 May 2000, 23:17

Snake:

If you are in a ROTC/SMP program, according to the Army, your ROTC has precedence over your Reserve/National Guard training. So if the two conflict, your go with your ROTC class. I also believe (but am not sure) that your two week training period is waived for the summer you are going to Advanced Camp.

Something else to consider, also, is that you can only participate in SMP if you are: (a) Not the recipient of a ROTC scholarship and (b) There is a SMP slot available at the unit you want. This may disqualify you (because I believe green to gold is a scholarship?) and may disqualify Steven (if he gets an Army scholarship.)

If you (or anyone, actually) are trying to find a SMP slot it's worth having a talk with your PMS and the unit recruiter to find out what options are available.

99% of this information from AR 145-1, and I claim to have no experiance with any of this: ROTC, SMP, NG or SF. I'm just a wanna/gonnabe who's read a bunch of ARs. :P

cecil18

31 May 2000, 23:25

E19,

I hear what you are saying because one of the biggest hurdles for Rep 63 and prior enlisted in SFAS and the Q course is SUT, which one would get with more infantry training. A lot of money is spent for the schools up front, and when a canidate comes home on his sheild it becomes a money matter not an education of the soldier matter.

I think though with the more difficult MOS's (18D and 18E) for REP 63's, exposing one as early as possible to their entry level MOS and reinforcing it as they progress is important (i.e.-18E) due to the amount of theory and learning required ((morse code for example would require BMIC (basic morse code) and AMIC (advanced morse code) which is at Bragg)). From what I have seen and heard, REP 63's who go 18E have a difficult enough time starting out in the intro levels and then to try handling the acceleration to the q-course level is straining too. Most who come into to the 18E MOS (prior service, what I have seen in my short period) are previously commo related MOS's to begin with or have the luxury of a more gradual advancement of material comprehension (somthing not afforded to a REP 63) and don't really have an easy ride either.

I guess what I may be trying to say is that a REP 63 who goes 18E, but has an 11B or 12B primary MOS MAY (no proof that I know of) in the end cost more to qualify due to recycles, if they don't get retasked as an 18B/18C due to being a NO GO on a block of instruction (test/re-test). Also if a REP 63 bolos totally in the Q (if he makes it that far) has an MOS that can still be used by either Support Company or another unit in the state. They may even come back and try again with time and exerperience under their belt.

A solution which has been done with prior service canidates who are soft skill MOS's was to send them to 11B or 12B AIT to get them exposure with a ruck and Op Orders, this in conjunction with their intro. commo. MOS may help a REP 63 make it through, but we end up back at the high cost issue that you mentioned.

I agree with you whole heartedly though on the importance of cross training within the MOS's. I don't think enough of it is done as is on AD or in the Guard. OP tempos are so high for AD that the soldier is always on deployment and gets shorted on the cross training that is needed.

I am not sure if I defended well enough E19, let me know. You made me think on a economic level which I don't usually do.

-Cecil

RKW

31 May 2000, 23:45

Cecil,
What is the time frame like for a candidate who has already gone through Basic, AIT, and Airborne? I ask because by the time I could get anywhere near a SF detachment, I would have 18-24 months in a unit. Well find out in November, but Im hoping the local LRSD. Id like to do SF in college. I think OldSFer made a great point, but as the oppertunity is there, and Id be willing to take a year off from college to go for it.

Thanks for the advice OldSFer, im exploring my options not just blowing you off. Im not sure if I want to be an officer, at least not right away.

Thanks for any help you guys could offer,
RKW

cecil18

31 May 2000, 23:49

Snake,

I decided to answer you in a seperate post.

It looks like your ROTC inquiry was answered very well, to the best of my knowledge (which is not alot in that area).

As for the deployment lengths is varies. It used to be some were 2 weeks, now many that are coming up are 3-3.5 weeks.

In the Guard (at least in Florida, can't speak else where) he can request his MOS. If he wants to be an 18B or 18C thats what he will be. One thing that may change that is if there are no slots available for that MOS. Remember MTOE, it drives us also. If there are slots he can choose what he wants, they may stress the critical ones so be aware.

As for the POC # fire me an email and I will pass it to you. Contact me from my profile info, the email is good.

By the way where are you going to school at (region will do), there may be a company near you that you are not aware of, things are always changing.

If you have any more ?, fire away.

-Cecil

cecil18

1 June 2000, 00:09

RKW,

You would be looking at a minimum time frame of 6 months for 18B or 18C, that does not include SFAS, PLDC, or Language.

You would have to attend PLDC and SFAS during the summers. It would be missing a summer A or B (we have two short semesters and one long here in Florida) and still be back in time to continue with college. Let me clarify: one summer would be PLDC, and the next would be SFAS.

Once you have those two you can plan which semesters you want to miss to go to Q. If you went to either of the previously mentioned MOS's and Language you would be gone one year on average, barring you don't recycle.

A good time to do the Q is in between your Sophmore and Junior years. You would not have entered your upper level college yet and would be rearin to go after the 1 year break.

I have to echo OLDSFer though, make college a priority. If you think you can juggle it more power to ya, if it hampers your ability to excell let it go and remember EDUCATION FIRST for now because you are young. You can always come back to SF when you are in you mid to late 20's.

One good aspect is that in a LRSD unit you will gain alot of tactical knowledge for your endeavors in SF or where ever you go.

I hope I was of some help. If you have any more ? post them, I look in frequently.\

-Cecil

E19

1 June 2000, 00:27

Cecil,

I was just curious because I was in REP-63 back in 66. I was an 18E (05B4S in those days). Went through BCT, AIT, & Airborne with about 450 other REP's and then went through SFTG. For the commo guys it took 9 months AD, which was the longest of all the MOS's since they put the medics through an abbreviated course.

Snake

1 June 2000, 08:04

Cecil,
lemme just try to nail down one specific thing. Rep-63, for -non- prior-E's,
is: Enlist-Infantry OSUT-Airborne-PLDC-SFAS
-Q course. In one -contigous- block, right?
Reason I ask is, Steven's gonna be down there in Tampa/St. Pete, living in a dorm or condo, and if he's gone for like, more than 2 months at a time, he'll have to find a new doss when he gets back. Just wanna give him a heads-up of what to expect. I can tell him -all- about Benning, but the Guard angle is beyond my experience.
Also, would it be a minus (in the eyes of the unit) if he was to enroll in ROTC after he got back? He only needs to do 2 years of it, due to being in JROTC in HS.
Also(yet again, heh), is there any waiting period for Rep-63's, from enlistment to OSUT? And are there any special minumum standards Rep-63's have to meet? Other than the Army's standards for Infantry enlistment?
As for myself, In another month and a half, I'll be in Oxford, MS. I'm using my GI Bill payola to put myself thru Ole Miss, and my wife wrangled herself a G2G scholarship. Both of us are going through ROTC as well. Is there an SF element within range up here? If so, I may give em a call and see what they can do me for....

Snake
25th ID(L)
"Lightning Leads The Way"

dk57

1 June 2000, 13:32

Sorry to butt in, but you guys seem to know your stuff when it comes to SF in the Guard. I'm looking to join the Guard as an officer and get involved with SF as soon as possible. I've been working with a recruiter, and what he has offered me is Basic, then Federal OCS at Benning, then IOBC, than Ranger School. After that I'll serve with a Light Infantry unit (where I could get Air Assault or Mountain Warfare school) and, when I make 1LT, I can tryout for SF.
Does this sound right? Is this the best way to get involved with SF as an officer?
Thanks in advance.

Whammer

1 June 2000, 13:48

Snake,

This may or may not be tracking with what you need, but regardless...
I have a buddy who enlisted NG for REP-63. He went 18E and therefore went Basic, then 31C school, then ARB. He drilled with his unit for about 1.5years then went through SFAS. He is now gunning for an 18C slot instead. So there are options down range even if you are pressed into 18E or 18D. Just food for thought...
di

cecil18

1 June 2000, 18:15

Snake,

I got some information for you and some corrections to make on information I had put out earlier.

The order for a REP 63 will be enlistment, Basic/AIT (11B or 12B less likely unless sloted for 18C), Airborne, then either PLDC or SFAS, and finally on to Q-course if the canidate doesn't get recycled in route (bolo SFAS). All in all Steve may be gone from 18 months up to 24 months. Alot of it is when the class dates fall in. He would be AD for the entire time until completion. The waiting period is up to the enlistee on when they want to step into the pipeline and be swept away for a few months (18-24).

Where I had put out inaccurate information was on the Basic/AIT portion. ALL REP 63'S WILL GO TO 11B Basic/AIT. I had inquired when I was down at the company today from the recruiter and a former REP 63. E19 was on the money with sending to REP's to an 11B MOS type school to get them ruck wise. SORRY http://www.specialoperations.com/ubboard/smile.gif

As for the ROTC hitch upon return, I personally don't think that would be a bad idea. Most of the guys in our Battalion are either working towards a 4 year degree or already have one, some have even gone on to OCS (due to age) and some have gone the ROTC route a year after returning. I say it would be supported and looked upon in a good light.

If anything, his time as an NCO will only enhance his professional development into an Officer.

I also found out that there is a company about 90 miles as the crow flies from your home base. It is in Columbus, MS (southwest of your intended location). If you would like email me and I will get the Company # for the TNG NCO and you can look in to it.

-Cecil

cecil18

1 June 2000, 18:22

E19,

I had to post and eat my crow when it is due! You had got me thinking last night and when I inquired today at the unit they set me straight. They do send REP 63's to 11B Basic/AIT primarily and then onto Airbrone, PLDC/SFAS and onto the Q.

http://www.specialoperations.com/ubboard/wink.gif Thanks for not clackin the claymore on me and letting me get the strait info. out.

By chance where did you do your time unit wise?

-Cecil

cecil18

1 June 2000, 18:34

dk57,

The information the recruiter is offering sounds to be on target in preparing you for that route. It will give you the time for developement and experience that is looked upon in process. Make sure you get it all in writting though when it comes time to sign the contract.

I will say this, there is more than one way to skin a cat though. I have had friends who came into the unit as O-1 NQP's (non-qualified person) and gone onto the course that way, they were ROTC cadets though, and it took a little while longer that way.

The package you have offered sounds like a better way because you will recieve your training consecutivly.

Best of luck with your decision.

-Cecil

dk57

1 June 2000, 20:05

Cecil,
Thanks for the response. In terms of getting everything in my contract, what should that include? I'm not sure how much they are willing to put in an OCS contract.

DK

Snake

1 June 2000, 22:27

So he'll be on AD the whole way through? And he can start the pipeline right after enlistment, no waiting? Excellent! Thats just what he wanted, as having to stroll back to Tampa every 3 months and wait, with that interrupting school and employment...
And you say they send everyone to Infantry OSUT? Noooooooooooo, anything but that!! Heh.
Bennings the best training in the Army, OSUT-wise. They could send him to Jackson, and make him wear perfume and garters.....heh.
Most likely they'll route him through the Spanish course, no? Anyway, he would prefer to go 18B, as any 20 year old would, with 18C and Delta following. I'll run this info over to him, and see if he has any Q's. It'll be August before he's back down there, for Fall session, and he wants to get that semester in. After that, he's ready to -go-.

Thanks

Snake
25th ID(L)
"Lightning Leads The Way"

RKW

1 June 2000, 22:56

Cecil,
Thanks a bunch man. I definintly see your point. Whether Ill be bullheaded and go anyway... Youre pretty swamped here, so if I might just ask a last question, Ill give you some peace.

The time table sounds like I come back fully qualified before my junior year, correct? Now, that sounds like Ill have about 2 years on a team before I graduate. If I am considering/planning reenlisting active duty after college, would these two years be well spent on a team? Or would I benifit more spending the 5+ years in a NG LRSD?

Thanks again,
RKW

Michael Robertson Moore

5 June 2000, 19:58

This thread has been full of useful information, but I'm still a little hazy on the time frame. I'm assuming an enlistee in REP 63 goes to OSUT as an 11B, followed immediately by Airborne. Does he then head off to an ODA for NQP time before PLDC or is it straight from Airborne to PLDC?

E19

5 June 2000, 21:10

Cecil,

Wasn't looking to make you eat crow. You are being very helpfull to the guys looking for answers about SF in the NG.

I was in the 11th, 12th & 19th Groups. I did my all my AD assigned to the 7th. That was a one time program because training (BCT & AIT)slots were short because of the buildup for Nam. On the downside we lived in tents in the original SF area on Smoke Bomb Hill for BCT & AIT, however on the upside upside we spent the whole time in SF and got better training without the regular Army horseshit. The old SF'ers trained us without the candyass harassment...including OldSFer!

[This message has been edited by E19 (edited 06-05-2000).]

cecil18

6 June 2000, 12:16

RKW,

Yes you "should" come back qualifeid by your junior year in college. As for the time spent that is hard to say. Both provide excellent development in the ares of SUT and OP ORD's. If SF is what you want to do as a short/long term life goal go that route.

If you are Qualified and transfer to AD you would go right to the teams and travel. That is if you go as an NCO. If you opt to go for the commission and the 18A course then you will have more schooling and possibly may go back to the teams as a 01/02 (I am not sure in the AD arena on that though)If your lucky. The regs on that are "guidelines" and can be shaped in different situations, just keep that in mind for any thing you do in the military.

Best of luck! http://www.specialoperations.com/ubboard/wink.gif

Michael,

If you are a REP 63 you won't go near a team until you come back to your unit Qualified. That means Airbonre, PLDC, SFAS, and Q-course on Active Duty. Your tasking while waiting for class dates would probably doing misc. details on post since you are in a holding status.

If you do come back to the unit un-Qualified you would be placed with the NQP squad and train up in your weak area in preparation for your next battle. Barring you were not invited back to the party. That happens too.

E19,

Thank you, it sound like you had the opportunity to do/be in alot of hair raising experiences, especailly with 7Th. Not to be nosy, but was that time spent in Vietnam or in South America. Both were hot spots in themselves.

Your time in 11th or 12th, was that spent in Florida by chance? I can't preicisely recall if it was 11th of 12th in Tampa, I think it was 12th.

-Cecil

Michael Robertson Moore

12 June 2000, 19:53

Are NQPs eligible for any schools during the year/year and half or so they're training before getting a shot at SFAS?

cecil18

12 June 2000, 22:15

Michael,

If the individual is a REP 63 they will only get that training needed to get them prepared for Q-course. Those being Baisic, AIT, Airborne, PLDC, and SFAS. No deviations.

An NQP who is prior service is very similar. PLDC (if they haven't gone), Airborne (if they are a leg), and SFAS. The Guard won't invest any more than that until the canidate comes back Qualified.

There is one acception for NQP's though and that is 11B school for those individuals who are a soft skill MOS and request 11B to improve their weaknesses in SUT and OPORD's. The 18E canidates may have a chance to go to BMIC (basic morse code). Other than that no other schools.

Things do vary from Battalion to Battalion depending on which state you sign with. I speak on experience from 3/20th in Florida.

I hope I have been of some help.

-Cecil

Snake

12 June 2000, 23:36

Cecil,
if it aint OPSEC, can you give us an idea (or recent history) of the projects/ops undertaken by the 3/20th? Say our boy is an 18Bravo or Charlie, what is he called upon to do? I'd heard something about you guys helping the Caribbean League and DEA guys out with busting J-farmers, but no details.
Can you give us a few examples of what life in the 3/20th is like?

Snake
25th ID(L)

cecil18

13 June 2000, 23:28

Snake,

The missions we have been undertaking in the the last few years are FIDS (foriegn internal defense). We go down and train in light fighter tactics mostly with alot of medical training.

An 18B or 18C would be teaching classes alot of the time and be helping out on the range. We also incorporate the usual engineer training too.

Another large tasking have also been the MED READY (providing medical assistance in South and Central America). These are really gratifying missions in that you can see how you make an impact on people.

We have not been tasked in helping out the DEA in counter drug missions overseas. I have heard of such missions, but that was about 6-8 years ago. I am not aware of any these days. Then again it is probably a need to know basis thing too.

-Cecil

Snake

14 June 2000, 03:09

Cecil,
how often do you guys deploy? Also, how do you guys keep you language skills (Spanish, French and Portuguese?) from deteriorating?

Snake
25th ID(L)

Michael Robertson Moore

14 June 2000, 14:21

And what is the typical length of a deployment?

cecil18

14 June 2000, 18:52

Snake & Michael,

I'll answer both of your questions in on post.

Our deployments multiple taskings per fiscal year. It comes down to about four deployments per company. That keeps four ODA's busy leaving two. Of the two not going OCONUS as a team, they may be used to plus another team that is going OCONUS. Note that one team usually is tasked every year with training the NQP's that would include the two week annual training (AT) period too. Keep in mind that nothing is in stone until the team is in-country.

We also have our JRTC rotation comitment to meet also every few years too, that changes how/who deploys then too.

Language skills are always a tasking to keep up on. That is usually up to the individual to keep abreast of. I myself get rusty and try to really practice the basics about 6 weeks prior to the deployment.

The deployments run about ~21 days +/-. It is really a great time.

-Cecil

Dock

23 June 2000, 17:23

Great information on REP-63.. Question..

I want to enlist as a REP-63. I understand that I will be away for a staight period of time 18 to 24 months. OSUT, Airborne, PLDC, PreSFAS, SFAS, Q, Lauguage, SERE... = 18 to 24 months.

Would it be worth it to have my wife move to North Carolina while I am in Q for 6 to 12 months?? Will I see her during Q course?? or are you restricted to barracks??

I guess my question is will she get to see me much during this 18 to 24 month period of time. (Saying I am selected, and move on FIRST time though) My wife understands completely the focus, and support she will need to have through this. She is wanting to move to a warmer state in a big way LOL. NC, SC, Georgia, Colorado..etc.. If I sign with (example) the Colorado NG SF Group, would she get to see me much in NC while in Q, and the other schools? Then move together to Colorado...

I look forward to a reply from someone who knows what I am talking about.

Thanks in advance.

Doc out...

cecil18

24 June 2000, 08:11

Doc,

Yes, you can take your wife to NC when you attend Q-course. I would wait until you have been selected and get a course date to attend before you put your wife through the strain of relocation.

You will not be locked down during phase II of the 3 phases. Phase I and III will be in the field at Camp McKall (Roe Trianing Facility (RTF)) and would be condsidered lock down conditions because you will not be permitted visitors.

As for moving here when in the other parts of training (Basic/AIT, Airborne, PLDC, etc..) I can not comment specifically. It could be posssible though.

If I can answer any other questions fire away.

Best of luck!

-Cecil

cecil18

24 June 2000, 08:28

Doc,

To answer you question, YES. Your wife should be able to relocate with you once you get a Q-course date. It is considered a permanent change of station (PCS) move. I would make sure you have a date in hand and confirmed before you put the strain of a relocation on your wife.

You should not be locked down during Phase II since it is the class phase in the garrison area on Bragg. Phase I & III will be locked down since you will be out on Camp McKall in the Roe Training Facility (RTF). You will not be permitted any visitors for those phases (each about +/- 30 days).

Hope I have been of assistance. If you have any other questions fire away.

Best of luck!

-Cecil

[This message has been edited by cecil18 (edited 06-26-2000).]

Dock

24 June 2000, 11:24

Thanks Eric/Cecil for your info..

I do have another questions. Lets say for example that I join with the 20th in Chicago because I live in Wisconsin which is only 3 hours away and would be easy to travel after I am hard tabbed SF and return to my Group. Is it possible to change states after you have signed with Chicago, and gone through 24 months of training and come back tabbed??? Or are you pretty much locked in with the Group that you signed with? I guess I am asking if guys ever move from one State to another after being SF tabbed.

Also wondering if you "Cecil" have the state locations for all the 19th and 20th groups? I would be interested in knowing my options in other states... Could e-mail me: brads@gdinet.com

Many thanks again for all your help... http://www.specialoperations.com/ubboard/smile.gif

Doc out....

Dock

24 June 2000, 23:31

hey Cecil... You out there..???

Doc out...

cecil18

26 June 2000, 17:48

Doc,

Yes you can move from state to state and in doing so transfer to another SF unit either in that same Battalion or Group.

Mind you though, when you do move, you start over again in gaining/earning points for retirement in that new state/unit. That might be a consideration in the decision making process.

-Cecil

SAPPER317

27 June 2000, 11:24

Cecil and Doc,

The retirement points/drill credits that you earn stay with you whereever you go in the military. They even transfer when you go to a different service.

What Cecil did say about starting over, can apply to a "good year", meaning that you have satisfied the military's requirement for receiving credit.

It is important that any and everybody keep a good calendar/diary on when they attended drills. Check with your OPS NCO to make sure you are receiving credit. Keep copies of orders, LES documents, and of course medical (sick call) papers. All can be used to verify your attendance.

When you do discover a mistake, submit the correction through your unit, and keep copies of these documents as well. A lot of unit administrators will tell you, you have to do it on your own. They are supposed to submit it, but because it is a lot of checking of past unit attendance records, they shun it.

Be careful, as a unit can mark you as present, but no credit. There are a lot of ways for a unit to carry a soldier on it's books.
Those guys out there that are thinking about joining SF, take extra care. Often, you are only attached to the SF for training. Your original unit still retains you for administrative purposes and of course, pay purposes.

Always, always check. This includes your active duty time. In the last eleven years, my time in service has fluctuated three times. The Army NG was the worst.

SAPPER317