ODA in support company?

[ODA_309]

Excuse me, but how do ODA name themselves in support companies? Or are there ODAs in a support company in the first place. Thanks.

[jeff]

Support companies don't have ODAs in them. Some 18-series will be there, ie. the Base Station. But they are not organized in the traditional A-team

[BrandonD]

Yep, no ODAs. Instead you get lots of dedicated non-tabbers that have a thankless job http://www.socnetcentral.com/ubboard/wink.gif

[Tracy]

No ODAs in the Support Companies; but if you lose any support personnel, they shanghai SF teams to pull support. No support troops, no SF deployment; they're a helluva lot more critical than people think.

In 1979, our SF Bn jumped into Ft Carson onto Mile-High DZ in 'marginal' winds. We took 37% casualties. That's 37% hospitalized, plus 25% walking wounded. Our support slice was almost wiped out to a man. The BC took 9 SF ODAs offline to backfill the support slots. The remaining 9 ODAs took another 50% casualties on insertions.

[ODA_309]

So what do you call them? Like squad so and so fall in now?!!

Anybody mind telling me how are they organized in support coy?

[Doogie321]

SPT CO has 3 Detachments, Service Det, Signal Det, and MI Det.

Service Det: Air Delivery Section, Mess Section, Supply and Transport Section. Think of parachutes, beans, bullets, and vehicles.

MI Det: ELINT guys, their Base Station (commo) and the Intel analysts and CI section.

SIGDET (My home): The Base Station (talks to the ODAs), the Message Center (tracks all messages and insures OPSEC on message traffic), Elecronic Maintenance section (fixes things when they have the parts. Cards for the newer radios are expensive), Switch (landline for internal communications) and the TSC-122 van for (supposedly) commo to higher. This van is always broke so we roll the operators into the Base Station and plus up the Message Center for our commo to the JSOTF or Group.

Counting the Co. CDR and his 1SG, we have slots for 5 or 6, 18 series in SPT CO, 3 of which are 18E.

My thanks to the kind words from the BTDTs about SPT CO. We exist because of y'all, and your job is made that much "easier" because of us.

EJA
SPT CO guy for 8 years now
BTAR

[wally]

We used to include the support guys in some of the training we did. They liked the demo range but weren't too crazy about surf ops. It was our way of saying thanks for the support they gave us in training and real world. Takes an awful alot of people to support just one team in the field. There used to be talk of offering the support guys a skill identifier so that they would return to SF after completing various required assignments.

[Doc]

Wally,

They do recieve an identifier now.

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DOC 1/7
DOL

[Doogie321]

Originally posted by gear_guru:
Doogie, go down to the MID and ask where you can find the "ELINT" guys. There aren't any at Bn Level and only one at Group.
The "SIGINT" guys are on the (now two) SOTs-A and SOT-B.



GG, you are correct. I lump ELINT and SIGINT into the same category. I didn't want to discuss SOT-A's and -B's as I am not aware of what is public about them and what isn't.

Thank you for the correction.

BTAR

[Door Kicker]

If you have a qualifing MOS and are deployable in an SF group, I think for at least a year, then you are awarded an "S" identifier on the end of your MOS after the skill level. Just like ABN qualified guys get the "P" for paratrooper.
Signal,Intel,Riggers and a few other guys would qualify for the "S" but a cook would not.

example: 11B2P would be a sgt in the infantry that was abn qualified.

In a deployment, the A team will pull support guys from the different DET's to form B teams. Mission dictates what MOS's are pulled. In 7th Group, when deploying at a team level, it was up to the individual how much he was involved in the A team's training.

During Operation Just Cause, several Spanish speaking support guys assigned to 7th were pulled on teams and went door to door with them looking for bad guys. Regardless of MOS. They were usually right up front when the door was kicked in. These non 11 series and non 18 series guys were awarded the CIB for this duty. It was very controversial sp? and took some doing but happened years after the conflict was over.
On Co level deployments, support pretty much stayed with with their DET's. Also, when all teams are full for particular 18 series MOS's, New 18 series guys have to find jobs on the support side until positions open.

[Harry56]

I just found this site recently and hope I did everything to get registered properly.

The support topics are really interesting since I was assigned to Svc Co 10th SFG(A)as a cook, food service sgt, det.nco, etc, whatever you want to call me, you never called me late for breakfast, lunch, or dinner or cross training when the offer came up.
I served 21 years in the Army as 11b and 94b
and I had some great assignments with great people but the "BEST" was my time in the 10th.
Some of you may think, even believe, that cooks are just another support puke, I had 12 cooks assigned to me with the lowest pt score being 297 out of 300. These cooks could land nav, were weapons qualified, and volunteered for anything and everything that came up, for training. A couple even left to become Rangers and attended SFQC afterwards.
Thank God for smart Sr NCO's that noticed dedication and the will to learn that let us do some cross training with their teams. I am one of the "Correspondance Course" qualified's you speak of though I never got to SFAS, only what cross training I was fortunate enough to grab with different ODA's, and individuals and they all made damn sure I put into practice "ALOT" what I learned in the books.
When I left there and went to Korea, I brought knowledge with me to an engr. unit that the commander, and 1st sgt never learned.
If you want a good gorp (trail) mix recipe drop me a line or any other recipe for that matter.
I'm damn proud of the coin I carry to this day, and my service to SF or SF service, and I dare any bastard here or anywhere else to deny me that right,the coin doesn't have a graduating class number on it but, it was giving to me at Gp HQ in an official ceremony. And I'm even prouder to say that I supported/SUPPORT any and all SF troops to this day. I still get pissed to see a black beret on a non qualified head, but even more so a black, green, maroon, or tan beret worn like a goddamn pizza. Where it right or hang it up!!!
As was written in one post elsewhere on this site: It's not the tab that makes the man.......Remember you can go for a short time, long time or just an overnight but, YOU're gonna get hungry!!!!!

[Ranger002]

Welcome to the Board Harry! The cook and support guys I served with kept this old Ranger very happy and I am forever greatful!
William Hazen

[Jeff Rambo]

You earned yourself a special seat, Harry. It'll be here for your use whenever you feel the urge to post.

Stay safe and glad to have you aboard.

[Doc]

Welcome aboard Harry.

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DOC 1/7
DOL

[Dark Helmet]

Originally posted by Harry56:
I had 12 cooks assigned to me with the lowest pt score being 297 out of 300.

You can almost always judge a leader by his troops.

Welcome aboard, Harry.

[Dark Helmet]

Double tap.

[This message has been edited by TackDaBoat (edited 09-25-2001).]

[Harry56]

It was/is our pleasure I'm sure Ranger. Given the opportunity I'd do it again, only better. There is no finer joy, save sex, than to have a team come in from a long hard MTT and feed them a great hot meal espicially breakfast.
Originally posted by RangerHazen:
Welcome to the Board Harry! The cook and support guys I served with kept this old Ranger very happy and I am forever greatful!
William Hazen

[Harry56]

Thank You all for your acceptance, it's great to be back with Quiet Professionals.

If you are looking for good recipes for the trail or to use at home give me a holler, I've got em all from U.S. military standards to Escoffier to some I created.

I've finally found an intelligent site with
intellectuals that can converse in discussions that are good for the soul.

Thanks again for the welcome.

[Greenhat]

Intelligent? You haven't noticed the pictures, huh?

Welcome aboard, Harry. Cooks and Docs are always welcome. :-)

------------------
De Oppresso Liber

[Doc]

Harry, Check this out. My response was about a FTX we did in 1/7 in August 2001.

http://www.socnetcentral.com/ubboard/Forum6/HTML/000879.html




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DOC 1/7
DOL

[Harry56]

That is a great picture of the Ranger Cooks Doc. I saw someone here comment on how the best cooks come out of SOF units and it's true.
I don't recall his name but he is a chef/owner of a fine dining restaurant in Arizona or New Mexico and is a 5th Gp Vet from Nam. I'm a past president of the local American Culinary federation Chapter, and a Certified Executive Chef, and the only folks I know that are executive chef's or master chefs (certified) are prior SOF people. You very rarely run into a military cook on the outside at least on the east coast.
Most cooks in the army get a bad rap because of their lazy ass leaders, namely E-6 and above that don't want to train them they always use the excuse that they had too much to do. The guy that woke me up early was Clarence Wright from 5th, 7th, and 10th Gp's
he showed up at a dining facility at Devens and began cleaning house. Your day started with pt at 0600 then home for a shower, back to the d.f., in ranks inspection, on shift for 12 hours, class, (no sleep) then another 12 hour shift. It broke the monotony alot. Originally posted by Doc42:
Harry, Check this out. My response was about a FTX we did in 1/7 in August 2001.

http://www.socnetcentral.com/ubboard/Forum6/HTML/000879.html

[Billy L-bach]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:

In a deployment, the A team will pull support guys from the different DET's to form B teams. Mission dictates what MOS's are pulled. In 7th Group, when deploying at a team level, it was up to the individual how much he was involved in the A team's training.

During Operation Just Cause, several Spanish speaking support guys assigned to 7th were pulled on teams and went door to door with them looking for bad guys. Regardless of MOS. They were usually right up front when the door was kicked in. These non 11 series and non 18 series guys were awarded the CIB for this duty. It was very controversial sp? and took some doing but happened years after the conflict was over.
On Co level deployments, support pretty much stayed with with their DET's. Also, when all teams are full for particular 18 series MOS's, New 18 series guys have to find jobs on the support side until positions open.

I call bullshit on this one dude...
I lived on Rio Hato, in D/2/7 working in the EMS section for FOB 72 and I am here to tell you... NOBODY no matter how far into town you went got a CIB unless they were an 11 or 18..... the closet thing to a freebie combat award was the preventive medicine guy being awarded a CFMB...
further more - quite a few support guys spoke spanish, and I can assure you, none of the teams from 2/7 put ANY support guy 'up front when the door was kicked'..... maybe the guys back at Allbrook were doing some 'support guy CQB' but if you were staging out of Rio Hato the closet thing to CQB the support guys did was walk down to the academy compound and steal air conditioners for the rest of the FOB...
or sneak into 'Manuels' beach house to take pictures of the spiral staircase.......

as far as it being up to the individual how involved he got in A-TEAM training? What team daddy did you work for that let support guys decide how involved they are gonna get?

Maybe my memory isnt as good as it used to be... but I am quite sure if my memory is that bad someone will help me tighten up my shot group....

[MARK92A]

Nice to have another QM guy on here!

HOOAH!

SUPPORTING VICTORY!!

[XGEP]

"In 1979, our SF Bn jumped into Ft Carson onto Mile-High DZ in 'marginal' winds. We took 37% casualties. That's 37% hospitalized, plus 25% walking wounded."

Tracy,

I know what you mean about 'marginal winds' I live in Colorado Springs, we seem to have, no wind, medium wind, and tie down the dog. Personally I wouldn't want to jump in anything but no wind considering medium wind is about 10-30 miles per hour.

------------------
XGEP

[Jaeger]

Originally posted by XGEP:
"In 1979, our SF Bn jumped into Ft Carson onto Mile-High DZ in 'marginal' winds. We took 37% casualties. That's 37% hospitalized, plus 25% walking wounded."

Tracy,

I know what you mean about 'marginal winds' I live in Colorado Springs, we seem to have, no wind, medium wind, and tie down the dog. Personally I wouldn't want to jump in anything but no wind considering medium wind is about 10-30 miles per hour.


A good friend of mine spent some time in Colorado Springs at the OTC training for cycling. He said that it didn't matter what the weather was like when they rolled out for a training ride and that you could count on it changing at least twice before getting back into town.

To remain somewhat on topic: What is the feeling at Grp about Carson? Has it proved superior to Devens when it comes to training etc.?

[XGEP]

Uh... sorry but I don't know what Grp is (I'm not in the military yet remember) The thing about the OTC is extremely true, expecially during fall or spring, it can snow, rain, hail, sun shine, then snow again all in a 2 hour period (and it HAS happened)we actually went to the OTC as a poolee function, one of the recruiters had trained there in weightlifting before getting injured.

------------------
XGEP

[Ranger002]

I have jumped into Fort Carson twice. The first time was a ramp jump out of a 130 with 2nd Batt. I hit so hard I did backflips and it ripped my trouser leg from hip to ankle...My good Ranger bro Gene Frink broke his back and several of us got banged up pretty bad.
My Second jump effectively ended my Reserve SF Career... my lowering line got tangled up in my legs and I hit hip first shattering my hip breaking my femur and partially tearing my femoral artery THANK GOD FOR SF MEDICS or I would NOT BE HERE...LOL. I HATE FORT CARSON!!! LOL
William Hazen
PS. On side note be careful what you post here newbies... or you will get called on it by the many Real Deals lurking in the background. I am curious to see how this one turns out. LOL

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by Billy L-bach:
I call bullshit on this one dude...
I lived on Rio Hato, in D/2/7 working in the EMS section for FOB 72 and I am here to tell you... NOBODY no matter how far into town you went got a CIB unless they were an 11 or 18..... the closet thing to a freebie combat award was the preventive medicine guy being awarded a CFMB...
further more - quite a few support guys spoke spanish, and I can assure you, none of the teams from 2/7 put ANY support guy 'up front when the door was kicked'..... maybe the guys back at Allbrook were doing some 'support guy CQB' but if you were staging out of Rio Hato the closet thing to CQB the support guys did was walk down to the academy compound and steal air conditioners for the rest of the FOB...
or sneak into 'Manuels' beach house to take pictures of the spiral staircase.......

as far as it being up to the individual how involved he got in A-TEAM training? What team daddy did you work for that let support guys decide how involved they are gonna get?

Maybe my memory isnt as good as it used to be... but I am quite sure if my memory is that bad someone will help me tighten up my shot group....

Well tighten up BULLSHITTER!!

C/3/7 was in Panama.
SFC Mario 43E3S PMOS awarded CIB for duty in Operation Just Cause. Last I knew hes was still with the Golden Knights.

And as far as the "Team Daddy" comment, I can't help it if they treated YOU like shit, but most were cool and invited any support guy along for training.

Lets see if I have a few examples......
1) water jump with DRAGOR for SCUBA team. All those who WANTED to were allowed to participate, scuba qualified or not.
2) Halo train up in Chile. as many jumps as you could stand as long as you were safe.MC4 or MC5.
3) Red Flag 94-4 deployed with ODA and EZAPAC(Spanish Special Forces)By choice.Starting in ISOFAC..... do you know what that is?
PJM for the jump (thats primary Jumpmaster for the Bull Shitter)Then did all training includeing live fire with GLID and A-10 AF aircraft."smart bombs?"
4) Cabanias 95 attended Ecuadorian Comando school BUY CHOICE and was Instructor in Jumpmaster School for foreign nationals(several times over for countless different countries)
5) foreign weapons training, certification......I could go on and on and maybe when I get the chance I'll come back and complete this post.

[longrange1947]

Door Kicker - Be very careful! C/3/7 was indeed Panama but 2/7 went into Rio Hato after the Rangers.

NO support guy is just given an S or an 18 series for working on a team.

NO Team SGT is going to allow anyone that is not qual on a DRAGOR to use much less jump the dam thing. He would be crucified when you killed yourself with the dam thing.

NO Team SGT would allow a non qual do "as many HALO jumps with MC4s 5s or whatevers. Again he would be crucified.

Yes support guys were trained by ODAs when attached, but not according to what the support guy wanted but what the Team SGT allowed and that did not detract from training.

Do not blow too much smoke, I was a Team SGT from 78 until retirement in 90 and I had 8 years with C/3/7. I was also assigned with C/2/7, at Rio Hato, with my Det assigned to the Aguadolce area.

Any more questions?


------------------
Hold Hard Guys

Rick B

[WS-G]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:
1) water jump with DRAGOR for SCUBA team.
Try Dräger.

[Harry56]

Your right Longrange. I did alot of cross training but it was at the Team Sgt's will and want. Water jumps were very well planned and if you were cross training and hadn't made every brief from start to finish, or the members of the team didn't feel comfortable with you along you WERE NOT allowed near the chute shed let alone the tarmac!
As for S designators, I completed the correspondence course in record time with 100% but I retired WITHOUT an S designator, and rightfully so even though I did ALOT of training on my own as well as volunteered for cross training, if you don't go to SFAS and so on you shouldn't be allowed the designator, that's a personal opinion, but for those that have completed QC or Ranger training, they went through the real deal and as such should be the ONLY ONES allowed to display that tab. I have a beret with a full flash on it simply because that's what I was issued. I'm proud of it, but WOULD NEVER claim to be qualified no matter how much cross training, etc I had,if I was in the presense of a qualified individual and it upset him that I was wearing a full flash I would explain it to him and if he still didn't agree then so be it, it would not be worn in his presense, real deals south of the border or not.

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by longrange1947:
Door Kicker - Be very careful! C/3/7 was indeed Panama but 2/7 went into Rio Hato after the Rangers.

NO support guy is just given an S or an 18 series for working on a team.

NO Team SGT is going to allow anyone that is not qual on a DRAGOR to use much less jump the dam thing. He would be crucified when you killed yourself with the dam thing.

NO Team SGT would allow a non qual do "as many HALO jumps with MC4s 5s or whatevers. Again he would be crucified.

Yes support guys were trained by ODAs when attached, but not according to what the support guy wanted but what the Team SGT allowed and that did not detract from training.

Do not blow too much smoke, I was a Team SGT from 78 until retirement in 90 and I had 8 years with C/3/7. I was also assigned with C/2/7, at Rio Hato, with my Det assigned to the Aguadolce area.

Any more questions?





The examples I stated are from my experience. I did those things, I jumped with the Drager by choice even though I was not SCUBA qualified.

I did jump as many times as I wanted on several HALO jumps/train ups (but I am HALO qualified)The MC5 is a static line MC4 and ANYBODY in group can jump one!!!!!!!

I was not just given an S identifier, I earned it over the course of a year plus completing certification with 7th Group. I don't know the minimum requirements but I know it takes at least a year.
From reading some of the replies I get the feeling that some here think an S identifier means you wear the SF tab quote from HARRY56 "if you don't go to SFAS and so on you shouldn't be allowed the designator, that's a personal opinion, but for those that have completed QC or Ranger training, they went through the real deal and as such should be the ONLY ONES allowed to display that tab."

The S identifier is specifically for support guys in Group that have attained SPECIAL skills while supporting SF in order to do their assigned job.For me those special skills were language classes, HALO and HAHO training, Para point training, special weapons training, as well as certification on SF common tasks. These are skills that only someone in SF would need in my MOS
It dosen't allow you to wear the SF tab or Green Beret.

The reason I stated eariler that a cook would not get one is only for example only. A cook would not need a special skill for his mission. I did however know some Ranger tabbed cooks in Group while I was there.


As far as my involvement with team training on a voluntary basis, well this stuff DID happen on every deployment I went on. I was eager to train with the team guys and as a result I was usually picked for deployments that would involve such training.
We had guys in our shop that hated that kind of stuff too and would either try to avoid deploying at all, or get the conus stuff that was easy.
Part of SF mission is FED (to train) don't you think that I was trained on the Drager before I used it? You are correct that no Team SGT would just say "here kid, try this out"
But if I was on a deployment with the mission of a team was to train foreign nationals to use the Drager, and I participated in that training(Because I wanted) and then was allowed to actually use it in the jumps that followed. That can and dose happen. Even though I can never pin on the bubble later and say I went to SCUBA school.

HALO on the other hand is a different story. The reason I was allowed to jump on HALO train ups is because I went to HALO school and Challenged the course.(I won't even go in to that) I do wear HALO wings and did graduate. But before I did, I jumped the MC5 in HAHO jumps while the bird was climbing for the HALO jumpers. This lead to my desire to continue with HALO training.

However I think that those that were actually at Group and know the environment that we were in know the truth about that anyway.

As far as Panama, I know what I know and a unit that was there when the SHTF and one that was sent later would most likely do completely different things.

You guys that claim to be SF but also say something would or could NEVER happen in Group, don't realize what you are saying. ANYTHING can happen in an SF Group


[This message has been edited by Door Kicker (edited 10-05-2001).]

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by Harry56:
Your right Longrange. I did alot of cross training but it was at the Team Sgt's will and want. Water jumps were very well planned and if you were cross training and hadn't made every brief from start to finish, or the members of the team didn't feel comfortable with you along you WERE NOT allowed near the chute shed let alone the tarmac!
As for S designators, I completed the correspondence course in record time with 100% but I retired WITHOUT an S designator, and rightfully so even though I did ALOT of training on my own as well as volunteered for cross training, if you don't go to SFAS and so on you shouldn't be allowed the designator, that's a personal opinion, but for those that have completed QC or Ranger training, they went through the real deal and as such should be the ONLY ONES allowed to display that tab. I have a beret with a full flash on it simply because that's what I was issued. I'm proud of it, but WOULD NEVER claim to be qualified no matter how much cross training, etc I had,if I was in the presense of a qualified individual and it upset him that I was wearing a full flash I would explain it to him and if he still didn't agree then so be it, it would not be worn in his presense, real deals south of the border or not.

Anybody can do a water jump. That is why we have pre jump training.
Correspondence courses have nothing to do with an S identifier. You are getting Paper Tab mixed up with S identifier.

You comments about full flash and beret are out dated.
Obviously you are from an earlier era and I respectfully dissagree with you in regards to the way it is now days.

When I first entered Group,90, everyone wore the Beret and flash. The SF tab was the designator for 18 series. All support were incouraged to complete an 18 series correspondence course(mine was 18D, most points for promotion)
By 93 the Green Beret was reserved for only 18 series and 18 series correspondence was done away with as a source for a paper tab.

The S identifier is a whole different thing completely. Correspondence courses do not qualify you for an S identifier. Only after you become deployable, complete certification, and have been in Group for over a year do you get the S. I think there are ore requirements but not sure. I did not seek out the S, I was just handed the orders one day and they explained what it was. I say "cool" and went about my bussines.

I have learned through my years in SF (support) first 7th and then 20th that you can never expect anything to happen like it should in the conventional Army, and you should never say something would NEVER happen in SF.

[TonyY]

Longrange1947. Cute name.. Hold Hard? Sounds familiar. Rick how come you haven't come over to the Teamhouse.net?

In the early 70's the candy-stripper paper flashes were not given an "S" qualification on their MOS after completing their paperwork and they could not come over to an A team from a B team or C support role. They only were allowed to wear the full flash which pissed a lot of people off. Only SFQC qualified would be assigned to an ODA.

We never had any enlisted attached to the team for training. Only officers. Usually doctors or dentists slotted for the Q course. And I don't remember it being any different with other teams or companies although I could be wrong.

But maybe things have changed.

[Billy L-bach]

DOOR KICKER...

If SFC "Mario" got a CIB in Panama it is because he held an 18 or 11 series MOS when he went... Maybe he changed his MOS after going to the Knights (I'll tell you what - they come to Yuma every January, I'll look him up and ask him myself... what was your real name again?)

No team daddy has EVER treated me like shit... by the way,what is a dragor?
Maybe its a secret version of the LAR-V that only YOU know about... helping the scuba team load them into the truck and then pumping up the zodiac is not the same as doing a paradrager...

WOW... you deployed on a Red Flag mission?
My hero!

What in the hell is a "FED" mission?


You also wrote----> "I went to HALO school and Challenged the course.(I won't even go in to that)"

...please, go into that.

Since we havent done a challenge course in over a year, did you go at Bragg? Did you go after they moved to Yuma?
Tell me about 'challenging halo school' hero...
Whats the number on your 'card'?
TALK TO ME ABOUT MC-4'S stud...
Tell me about military parachuting stud... What did "pjm" mean again?

Maybe my training has left me misinformed on how things are done when it involves a parachute...
MFFJM-8040
AMFFPC-100
MFFI-448
D-23111
AFFI
NCOIC-USAJFKSWCS MFFS video detachment...


Tell me about your "18D" training hero...
Maybe I have forgot a few things you could bring me up to speed on... I guess the correspondence course is where all the really hard stuff is taught... I was lucky I got to go to FT Sam where medical training was easy...

As for the hip pocket drager training...
Maybe you did do a paradrager, so you could help 'teach' host nation soldiers 'your trade'..... Good for you!
Do me a faver though Tell the team sgt that let you do that, SFC William Lauterbach said he is a dumb-ass, also tell the diver that gave you your DSPI (you DO know what a DSPI is dont you) that HE is also a dumb-ass, and last of all, tell the DMT that he is the biggest dumbass of the group for putting your life in danger, by letting you put on a LAR-V with out ever having you do the 60ft O2 tolerance test...
(you do know what that is dont you?)

As for MC-5 HAHO jumps... tell me some more...
Anybody in group?
Really?
The unit you are in lets people do HAHO's with an MC-5 without doing any transition training? They let 'anybody in group' do HAHO's? Tell the jumpmaster that let you go above 10,000 feet without a chamber ride know that I said he is a dumbass also...
I wish the ODA I spent the last 7 years on had been given such freedom to operate 'outside the box'...
Hell I am a civilian open water diver, and a school trained DMT and my FRIENDS on the scuba team would tell me to go shit in my hat if I tried to lay hands on a LAR-V with the intent of doing anything more than helping them don' it...

Did you get the nick-name "door kicker" because you drove a hum-vee past range 37 or did you do that by correspondence also...


... to all the 'SOCNET old timers, sorry if I seem a little rude for joining your board and jumping right into a flame war, but hey, a guys gotta do what a guys gotta do.....

..."jumpers away"

[colmurph]

Oh Jesus! Another Wannabee. By the way slug, it's spelled Draeger, seems that,that is the way the German firm that makes it, spells it. OK, you've been reading up on everything you can find out about Spec Ops. How about dropping some names? Do you know of any? Nobody seems to know you or anything about you. If you've ever done a HALO you would have a record in your Log Book. Do you have a log book? Who has signed off in your log book? Come on pogy bait, drop some names!
Bet you even have a "Coin" that you bought at "The Calvary Store". They'll sell shit to anybody who has the green. If you are a BTDT you must be an association member, what's your number?. Mine's D-6068 Life.

Murph

(I eat wannabees for breakfast, lunch and dinner)

------------------

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by Billy L-bach:
DOOR KICKER...

If SFC "Mario" got a CIB in Panama it is because he held an 18 or 11 series MOS when he went... Maybe he changed his MOS after going to the Knights (I'll tell you what - they come to Yuma every January, I'll look him up and ask him myself... what was your real name again?)

No team daddy has EVER treated me like shit... by the way,what is a dragor?
Maybe its a secret version of the LAR-V that only YOU know about... helping the scuba team load them into the truck and then pumping up the zodiac is not the same as doing a paradrager...

WOW... you deployed on a Red Flag mission?
My hero!

What in the hell is a "FED" mission?


You also wrote----> "I went to HALO school and Challenged the course.(I won't even go in to that)"

...please, go into that.

Since we havent done a challenge course in over a year, did you go at Bragg? Did you go after they moved to Yuma?
Tell me about 'challenging halo school' hero...
Whats the number on your 'card'?
TALK TO ME ABOUT MC-4'S stud...
Tell me about military parachuting stud... What did "pjm" mean again?

Maybe my training has left me misinformed on how things are done when it involves a parachute...
MFFJM-8040
AMFFPC-100
MFFI-448
D-23111
AFFI
NCOIC-USAJFKSWCS MFFS video detachment...


Tell me about your "18D" training hero...
Maybe I have forgot a few things you could bring me up to speed on... I guess the correspondence course is where all the really hard stuff is taught... I was lucky I got to go to FT Sam where medical training was easy...

As for the hip pocket drager training...
Maybe you did do a paradrager, so you could help 'teach' host nation soldiers 'your trade'..... Good for you!
Do me a faver though Tell the team sgt that let you do that, SFC William Lauterbach said he is a dumb-ass, also tell the diver that gave you your DSPI (you DO know what a DSPI is dont you) that HE is also a dumb-ass, and last of all, tell the DMT that he is the biggest dumbass of the group for putting your life in danger, by letting you put on a LAR-V with out ever having you do the 60ft O2 tolerance test...
(you do know what that is dont you?)

As for MC-5 HAHO jumps... tell me some more...
Anybody in group?
Really?
The unit you are in lets people do HAHO's with an MC-5 without doing any transition training? They let 'anybody in group' do HAHO's? Tell the jumpmaster that let you go above 10,000 feet without a chamber ride know that I said he is a dumbass also...
I wish the ODA I spent the last 7 years on had been given such freedom to operate 'outside the box'...
Hell I am a civilian open water diver, and a school trained DMT and my FRIENDS on the scuba team would tell me to go shit in my hat if I tried to lay hands on a LAR-V with the intent of doing anything more than helping them don' it...

Did you get the nick-name "door kicker" because you drove a hum-vee past range 37 or did you do that by correspondence also...


... to all the 'SOCNET old timers, sorry if I seem a little rude for joining your board and jumping right into a flame war, but hey, a guys gotta do what a guys gotta do.....

..."jumpers away"


I see you have read some FM's
If you read what I posted it should be clear that I am not claiming to be a bad ass. I am just describing my experience in Group. Calm down, I am not trying to take anything from you or the "image" you want here.
I will only comment here on things that I know for a fact. There is alot that I read here, and it is the first I have heard of it. Do I question it? No. I have no way of knowing who is on the other end claiming it to be true. As you have no idea who I am.

I realized a long time ago. No matter how far you have been, or how fast you did it, or how bad you think you have become. Sure as Hell someone better will come along and burst your bubble.

I challenged HALO in 94 under instruction of CWO Peters.
I don't have a log book but I do have a jump log kept by training. Only about 80 free fall,(recorded) not much at all.
It was all done at Bragg.
The Dragor was how I thought it was spelled on all our SCUBA gear(I still think it is), I am not talking about the LAR5 rebreather. Just regular scuba gear with regular tanks strapped on under the -1C harness for a routine water jump+ SCUBA gear.

What is wrong with Red Flag missions? that was some some cool shit we did, followed by some fun partying in LAS Vegas. Do you know what it is or just trying to ridicule me again?
Foreign Internal Defense, so I miss spelled it, won't be the last. Still did it and know what I am talking about.

As far as the MC5 static line chute, my first jumps were at the test board and then later at Group where "Anybody that wanted" was allowed to jump it. At the time it was said it would eventually replace the -1C but has yet to happen. Not saying that in NEVER will.

I am not claiming to have walked up to a pile of chutes and simply grabbed one. And you can go to 14,000 without O2 not 10,000. Unless that has changed and I can't imagine it has.

I have orders for the S identifier and don't care what you do or do not have.
I earned several coins. One when SGM Rabodgo SP? had to pull a reserve that I had packed.It was 7th SF writen in Spanish. Not for sale anywhere. I also have Ecudorian SF coin, and 20th SF coin. Both earned.

I got the nick name "Door Kicker" at SFAUC training when I stuck my foot in my mouth. The instructor asked if anyone knew the proper method for breeching a door. I answered "We kick it" and he laughed and said "Oh, we have a door kicker on our hands."

He then went on to instruct us in the proper method, and the name stuck for the rest of the course. Just incase you ask, that course was at Bragg too.

You attitude suggest that you have never been to an SF Group, and your dis-bellief that such things could happen there does too.


I am not a member of SFA, I got the aplication while in Panama with C/3/7 but never joined. Like I said, I am support with a S identifier, not an 18D.

I never said that the correspondence course was hard either. Or tried to say that your training that you have or not had was easy. You injected that to sound cooler as you attempt to make me look bad. Again go back and read what I posted.

And before all you wanna-be DICKs jump in, get a life please. I have forgotten more than most here will ever learn.

I have lived that life and remember it fondly. I am sure many here have done the same, but most here have not. But I would bet that NO ONE here is currently doing much at all or they wouldn't be here blabbing about it.

[colmurph]

DOOR KICKER! You are a wanabee! You haven't been there and hanven't done that. You're full of shit! Draegers were used for O2 on HALO and for breathing underwater. They were also used by the German U-Boot Service as an escape tool. They are also used by Merchant Ships in their fire fighting equipment and on Tankers to go into the pump rooms when the fumes are about. Again, I CHALLANGE YOU. I can't put my coin on this table, but I KNOW that you are full of shit! Post your serial number so we can check you with Jimmy Dean to see if you've ever been in a Group! Challenge me pogue!

Murph

[Door Kicker]

Hey COL MURF how many times are you gonna post the same shit?

Saying it over and over dosen't make it true. It dosen't take much to join SFA.

How many beers have you had at the Bar at an SFA chapter is a better question. I have had so many that I can't remember. pun intended.

Did you even know that you could actually visit an SFA chapter or that one existed? Or did you just join so you could post your member number here and pretend.

Do you know Col Pulley, LTC Greene both RET?
How about CSM Rambo currently at SWC? If you know Rambo, ask him who helped him cook craw fish at JRTC in 93?

All three of these men know me personally and I doubt they know you. But what does that prove? Absolutely nothing at all.

Again Get a life!

[This message has been edited by Door Kicker (edited 10-06-2001).]

[Jeff Rambo]

<Chuckle>

[Door Kicker]

I sent you my ss number colmurf so shut the fuck up

[This message has been edited by Door Kicker (edited 10-06-2001).]

[colmurph]

I'll keep posting it untill you disappear ASSHOLE! You want to drop some names? How about Walt Schumate?, he was one of my NCO's when I commanded an A team with the 3d SFG. (A-14) He went on to become an instructor at HALO and then, later Chalrie Beckwith's CSM at Project Delta. Then there's Marion Spicer who was my "Team Daddy" who the model for the statue "Bronze Bruce", he was later CSM of JFK Center. Then there was Bobby Richardson who was on my team and who I made a "Bootleg" jump with over Raeford, NC, he later became Center Seargeant Major and lost his coveted jump status not because he broke his leg on a jump but because he broke it playing vollyball! I jumped with Henry (Hank) Belton who was a Center CSM who said to me in 1987 "don't show anybody here in the GB club, your log book....I dont want them to think that I;m that old"! ( His entry is dated 8/9/66 in my log book)I also drank a few beers with D-38, Loy Brydon, when he was the CSM of 5th Group in RFN. Jaucque Istel. D-1 is in my Log Book as well as Steve Snyder D-5, Who is in your's? Do you know who Ora Lee Mize is? How about Charlie Norton? Can you tell me who AAron Bank is? Maybe you can tell me who Ruben Tucker was? Or possibly William P. Yarbourough? Did you know Jack McMull?, I think not! How about Joe Lutz? Lost again? Mike Healy? Maybe you can tell me what the Gabriel Demonstration was! I think everybody here can tell that I've BTDT but we still don't know who you are!

[Ace]

Holy shit!! I haven't checked this thread for awhile, this is better than fuckin' hockey, ROFLMMFAO

Jeff, if your awake, call me.

[colmurph]

Hey Ace! It's just beginning! Stick around a while and watch me "Pants" this ASSHOLE. I love doing this kind of work.

Murph

(I eat wannabees for breakfast, lunch and dinner)

[colmurph]

BTW, Asshole, you didn't send me your service number. If anybody here got it and I didn't, slap me up-side my cookie hole please! I'm tired of all these "Senior Moments". Don't think for a New York minute that that happened either! I may be an old fart but I don;t miss much!

Murph

(I eat wannabees for breakfast, lunch and dinner!)

[Ace]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:
I will only comment here on things that I know for a fact...........
And you can go to 14,000 without O2 not 10,000. Unless that has changed and I can't imagine it has..

Well, I'm not trying to get in the middle, but, I assure you, you will not find a pilot that will agree with that statement. And FYI that altitude is not an absolute, if you smoke, it gets lower.


Originally posted by Door Kicker:
....I have orders for the S identifier......

So do I, it would appear that we went 2 different routes to obtain it.
All I did was put in a 4187.


Originally posted by Door Kicker:
But I would bet that NO ONE here is currently doing much at all or they wouldn't be here blabbing about it.

Sounds like easy money to me. Keep in mind this isn't Military.com we police our own.


------------------
If one's words are no better than silence, one should keep silent.

[colmurph]

Jeff Rambo.

I'm sorry if I've pissed off any of your readers, but this guy just FLAMES ME! If I'm wrong about this pogue I will apologice and kiss everybodys ass! BUT.....I don't think that those drastic measures will be necessary as I'm totaly sure (I'll bet my next 10 years salary on it) that he's as phony as a three dollar bill) Pardon my occaisional lapses into GI english (Vietnam era) but this kind of crap can't go on!

Best Regards

Murph

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by colmurph:
I'll keep posting it untill you disappear ASSHOLE! You want to drop some names? How about Walt Schumate?, he was one of my NCO's when I commanded an A team with the 3d SFG. (A-14) He went on to become an instructor at HALO and then, later Chalrie Beckwith's CSM at Project Delta. Then there's Marion Spicer who was my "Team Daddy" who the model for the statue "Bronze Bruce", he was later CSM of JFK Center. Then there was Bobby Richardson who was on my team and who I made a "Bootleg" jump with over Raeford, NC, he later became Center Seargeant Major and lost his coveted jump status not because he broke his leg on a jump but because he broke it playing vollyball! I jumped with Henry (Hank) Belton who was a Center CSM who said to me in 1987 "don't show anybody here in the GB club, your log book....I dont want them to think that I;m that old"! ( His entry is dated 8/9/66 in my log book)I also drank a few beers with D-38, Loy Brydon, when he was the CSM of 5th Group in RFN. Jaucque Istel. D-1 is in my Log Book as well as Steve Snyder D-5, Who is in your's? Do you know who Ora Lee Mize is? How about Charlie Norton? Can you tell me who AAron Bank is? Maybe you can tell me who Ruben Tucker was? Or possibly William P. Yarbourough? Did you know Jack McMull?, I think not! How about Joe Lutz? Lost again? Mike Healy? Maybe you can tell me what the Gabriel Demonstration was! I think everybody here can tell that I've BTDT but we still don't know who you are!

All that proves what about me? Do you know the guys I listed? Sounds like you read some books. I can't believe you have never heard of CSM Rambo. Especialy if you are so Billy Bad Ass!!!!! I didn't ask for names, you did. And I expect the reason you did is so that you could list your names that you read about in all those books. Same way you bragg about being a member of SFA, when we all know that anyone can go to their web site and download an aplication, send in the money with some dates and most likely get a card. Big deal. Do all members of SF Groups join SFA? I think not.
You seem to think that if you can convince a few guys here that you have BTDT, then you have. And the more people you can diss-credit only helps solidify your claims. Well I ain't buyin. I don't know any COL especially SF that would act so childish and talk about how fun it is to "bust" wannabees on the net. And "eat them for breakfast" Does the term "quiet professional" mean anything to you? surely you have read about that? Or did the SF Group you were in teach you go around blowing your own horn? I doubt it.
I emailed my SS # to your email on file. If that is not the right one, then post another so I can re send it.

Yarbourough rings a bell but only because he was a former 20th commander maybe not the same one. You most likely will post here until I fade away because I don't post here much.

But you will never prove that I didn't do what I said I did. You will only find proof that I did.

As far as the 4187 requesting "S" I don't know, it was done for me and the others who got it by my NCOIC SFC Ortiz.
Furthermore, I am not claiming that this "S" makes me anything special, I was just answering a question.

It is sad that a grown man has nothing better to do than hang out here and bust wannabees. Makes you wonder......

The GB club was a sport parachute club and Bar by the time I got to Bragg. Only went there a few times. Did see some old timers sittin around mumblin bout how long their dick was..... maybe that was you........

colmurf I emailed you my SS like I said. It is time to put up or shut up. I KNOW what you will find. While you are at it, send me yours. I have seen SS # checks and I have a buddy that knows a site to verify unit affiliation and PMOS I will run yours too. Or are you scared?

And don't give me that "everybody here already knows bullshit either"

[colmurph]

My goodness, and excuse me folks,but DOOR KICKER doesn't want to answer me. Wonder why? Maybe that he's bull shit to the core (Not the Corps} (Some of my best buddies are former Marines)I'd really like to hear what he'sgot to say now.

As Always, your best buddy. Murph

(I eat wannabees for breakfast, lunch and dinner) sometimes I puke, can't help it.
(just happens when I meet up with scum!)

[Door Kicker]

I already answered you dick.
where is this proof?

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by colmurph:
Jeff Rambo.

I'm sorry if I've pissed off any of your readers, but this guy just FLAMES ME! If I'm wrong about this pogue I will apologice and kiss everybodys ass! BUT.....I don't think that those drastic measures will be necessary as I'm totaly sure (I'll bet my next 10 years salary on it) that he's as phony as a three dollar bill) Pardon my occaisional lapses into GI english (Vietnam era) but this kind of crap can't go on!

Best Regards

Murph
No, don't want to piss off any off your "believers" they might start to doubt you. I have emailed you about four times now. No response yet. What is your current email address?

[Door Kicker]

well colmurf has my SS# now but will not provide his. I wonder why.

[colmurph]

I've gotten about 4 e-mais from this pogue but he still hasn"t answered ONE of my questions. Guys, he's a PHONY. Don't waste your time on this kind of shit!

Murph

(I eat wannabees for breakfast, lunch, and dinner ,then I do unmentionable things to them) SPECIAL NOTICE TO CAJUNS!!!!!! Season ended yesterday, the bag limit is two, and they taste good. (Yankees pay good money just to say that they ate one!)

[Door Kicker]

so far I have sent 15 emails to colmurf and he still has no proof. despite the fact that he now claims to "know everything about me" and my next move will be "Checkmate"
In almost every email, I have asked him to provide his SS# too like I already have to him, but he completely ignores that request. I think he just has not come up with a snappy reply to that yet.

He undoubtly will figure out a way to explain that he is just tooo tooo high speed and hush hush to be allowed to tell just anybody that sesitive knowledge. He will also allow that his hands are registered weapons in every state
I really think this guy read tooooo many spy books. I kinda feel sorry for him to.
Sometimes when regular servicemen (legs) spend too much time around real Soldiers listening to their storys, they get low self esteem and have to creat a world inwhich they are real Badd Asses and have everyone tell them they are cool because they have BTDT.Kinda like AL Gore did.

so colmurf what have your intel sources provided you with?
I'll give you a hint
I was with 7th SF and 20th SF, infact I just left 20th this past DEC.PMOS 43E3S Get out your super gadget spy phone book and call 20th headquarters in Birmingham and ask if they remember SSG Nelson. Capuzo or Turner will always be there and remember me well. You will have no problem convinceing them that they should provide you with this sensitive info. Just drop some of those big names you were throwing around, OH and don't forget to give them your SFA member #. That is a proof positive in the spec ops world.

Hell, I'll make it easy on you. call 1 (205) 957 2349. If you get a recording dial 9 for Turner, my former NCOIC before I left. Don't forget your SFA #

[Door Kicker]

well I thought he would give in, but not this easy. He hasn't asked any questions that I have not answered. No I don't know all those guys because I didn't read all the books he did.

I have given proof and I am sure I will be getting a call from SFC Turner as to why I posted his number.

Not that it should be nessicary, but has this guy actually given any proof that he is an SF 18A like he claims. Much less a Full Bird SF'er. Besides that hard proof that he has an SFA member # and can drop names in his sleep?

His attitude and childish behavior make me strongly doubt that he ever was. In fact, he is displaying the tail tell signs of the very thing he accusses me of. Being a wannabee.

All this and he still will not give me his SS#. Yep he must be a poser.

[Ace]

I'll solve all of this BS.

1) I don't know either one of you.
2) I give a rats ass about either one of you.
3) What I do care about, is keeping the standards of this board in tact, meaning, if your a poser, I assure you, it will come out.

4) By the current count, **** is behind by 7 points.

Email me both your names and I will post who is who.
ColMurph, it would appear that you are from the 'Nam era (correct me if I'm wrong) I will contact E-19 and maybe OldSFer to verify your claims.

DoorKicker, I'll call Bragg to verify you, or do I need to call Alabama?

[Ace]

I have recieved Emails from both, more to follow, LOL.


[This message has been edited by Ace (edited 10-06-2001).]

[Billy L-bach]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:
I see you have read some FM's
If you read what I posted it should be clear that I am not claiming to be a bad ass. I am just describing my experience in Group. [/B]

No dude... you claimed to be a bad ass----->

Lets see if I have a few examples......
1) water jump with DRAGOR for SCUBA team. All those who WANTED to were allowed to participate, scuba qualified or not.
2) Halo train up in Chile. as many jumps as you could stand as long as you were safe.MC4 or MC5.
3) Red Flag 94-4 deployed with ODA and EZAPAC(Spanish Special Forces)By choice.Starting in ISOFAC..... do you know what that is?
PJM for the jump (thats primary Jumpmaster for the Bull Shitter)Then did all training includeing live fire with GLID and A-10 AF aircraft."smart bombs?"
4) Cabanias 95 attended Ecuadorian Comando school BUY CHOICE and was Instructor in Jumpmaster School for foreign nationals(several times over for countless different countries)
5) foreign weapons training, certification......I could go on and on and maybe when I get the chance I'll come back and complete this post. [/B]


... it sounds like bragging to me.
And you are right, as a matter of fact, I have read some FM's, a lot of them... and some regulations also. I know exactly what the FM's and regulations say, that is why I am so quick to think that maybe you are full of doo-doo...




I will only comment here on things that I know for a fact. There is alot that I read here, and it is the first I have heard of it. Do I question it? No. I have no way of knowing who is on the other end claiming it to be true. As you have no idea who I am...[/B]

Thats right NOBODY seems to know who you are...

I challenged HALO in 94 under instruction of CWO Peters.... I don't have a log book but I do have a jump log kept by training. Only about 80 free fall,(recorded) not much at all. [/B]

Was he the safety officer? I'll go to the SGM tuesday and look up CWO Peters "I-number" 1994 you say? I'll post Chief Peters "I-number" so everyone here knows he was real. By the way... only 80 jumps? To challenge the MFFPC you had to have a USPA B-license, (AT LEAST 50 JUMPS) So you are a civilian skydiver too? So you had 50+ skydives when you challenged the MFFPC, plus the jumps made during the course in 1994, and youve only logged 30+ jumps in the last six years? You dont have a logbook? CWO Peters let you challenge the course without a logbook to prove that you had the 50 skydives required to challenge the course? What did you say your B-license number was? I'm not saying you are lying, I am just asking for a few numbers... USPA 'B' and the number on your SWC form 2431 dated 1NOV85... (thats the little card they have given out at graduation for the last 15 years or so)


The Dragor was how I thought it was spelled on all our SCUBA gear(I still think it is), I am not talking about the LAR5 rebreather. Just regular scuba gear with regular tanks strapped on under the -1C harness for a routine water jump+ SCUBA gear. [/B]

I have a few water jumps myself, MOTT Lake, Wood Lake, The coast of Tunisia... but I dont remember scuba tanks being part of the 'routine'. My comment STILL stands about the Team-Daddy,DiveSup, DMT combination that would let you put on any kind of breathing aparatus without being school trained.... All three are idiots for unduly endangering you. Why dont you give us those names? I'd like to know so I can avoid ever having to work with them.
(BTW if you werent talking about a LAR-V you are probably refering to the blue and yellow 'DACOR' logo sticker...) If you are going to wear tanks without any formal training, you really should be more observant, after all, scuba diving can kill you. I'd hate for you to get hurt because those 'cool team-guys' you hang out with let you do something unsafe.



What is wrong with Red Flag missions? that was some some cool shit we did, followed by some fun partying in LAS Vegas. Do you know what it is or just trying to ridicule me again? [/B]

Nothing is wrong with red flag missions, Nellis AFB is a great place to go train. (personally I prefer Indian Springs AFAAF-less distractions) but if you want me to be impressed that you watched a few CAS runs.... *yawn*


As far as the MC5 static line chute, my first jumps were at the test board and then later at Group where "Anybody that wanted" was allowed to jump it....[/B]

I gather you are a rigger? So you're telling me, on jump day, never having jumped anything but t-10's, a guy from the motorpool can just wander up to the chute truck and say... hold onto to that belly mount my good man, I think today I'll be jumping that other one, the one with the neat little red pillow on it... and away he goes? What kind of clowns run that outfit? Who flies the aircraft, an off duty cook? Again, I ain't calling you a liar, but who is the NCOIC of your rigger shed?



And you can go to 14,000 without O2 not 10,000. Unless that has changed and I can't imagine it has. .[/B]

Well, when I did my HAP initial in July 94' it was as follows:
10,000 feet MSL supplemental O2 must be available.
13,000 MSL and above an approved O2 system must be worn prior to passing through 10,000 ft.
between 10,000 and 12,999 a mask is not required as long as time aloft does not exceed 30 minutes...
When I did refresher in 97 it had not changed
When I did refresher in 2000... it had not changed...
When the USAF phys-tec that runs our life support section teaches his 'O2' class, he puts out the same information...
So when did you do your HAPS training?
Did they teach you to go to 14000 ft before needing O2? It couldnt have been any earlier than 1991 because the card was only good for 3 years back then... Hell, I thought they had killed the MC-5 program altogether, If none of this applies to you, then your unit is doing some 'off the books' training that is probably to sensitive for me to ask you about...



I earned several coins. One when SGM Rabodgo SP? had to pull a reserve that I had packed.It was 7th SF writen in Spanish. Not for sale anywhere. I also have Ecudorian SF coin, and 20th SF coin. Both earned..[/B]

You got a coin... so?
By the way... its Rabago... Leonard or Leonardo I cant remember ... I just called him 'TOP'... (till he told me I hadnt been in the army long enough to call him top)


I got the nick name "Door Kicker" at SFAUC training when I stuck my foot in my mouth. .[/B]

You... foot in mouth?
Get outa town...
No way...
So far that is the only thing youve written yet that I believe 100%


You attitude suggest that you have never been to an SF Group, and your dis-bellief that such things could happen there does too..[/B]

...cant fool you can I.
I am just a 17 year old kid that has watched to many Steven Segal movies.



And before all you wanna-be DICKs jump in, get a life please... [/B]

When I was a support guy in signal company (later D/2/7) from April 87 til' June of 90, I always wondered why the team guys seemed to hate the support guys. (Support guys work long hours, tedious work, most of the time they are in before the operators, and still working when the operators go home)

YOU are the answer to that question... some support guys act like an american ninja hero because he sports an electric butter knife on his shoulder. They didnt even have 'identifiers' when I was a support guy, they didnt need them. A supply sgt is a supply sgt... a cook is a cook... a rigger is a rigger... a radio repairman is a radio repairman... Some support guys think that a five minute class on how to load/fire/reduce a stoppage on an AK-47 makes them a weapons expert? Hell I have no idea who Col Murph is... You on the other hand prefer to curse at him instead of answering a few questions. That my friend is why team guys generally dont like support guys.... How hard is it to prove us wrong... Me and 'Murph would be eating so much crow it would probably kill us...



I have forgotten more than most here will ever learn..[/B]

What have you forgotten dude? Did you forget where you left your car keys? I never learned that... I guess you would be correct - you forgot something I never learned.


...I would bet that NO ONE here is currently doing much at all or they wouldn't be here blabbing about it.[/B]

If I remember correctly YOU are the one one who started blabbing about support guys getting CIB's because they spoke spanish and walked around in Panama during Just Cause
{BTW that was in 1989... you later said you didnt get to group until 1990}

I put in my 2 cents because I WAS a support guy IN 7th group IN panama DURING just cause... and NONE of the people I served with EVER got CIB's... Then you so kindly decided to 'tighten my shot group' (for which I sooo thank you... now I can get on with my life) If I sound like I dont believe you, its because I dont... sorry dude. Prove me wrong, and I'll apologize.

Otherwise, go blow smoke up someone elses ass, because I aint buyin' it...

...jumpers away!



[This message has been edited by Billy L-bach (edited 10-06-2001).]

[Jeff Rambo]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:
How about CSM Rambo currently at SWC? If you know Rambo, ask him who helped him cook craw fish at JRTC in 93?

If you're going to drop names in attempts of verification, at least get your timeframes and commands together.

To give you an idea of how far off you are, CSM Rambo was at USASOC back in '97. If you have any idea what that means, you'd know how far off you are as far as him being at SWC. He'd have to be in a 3 star billet right now, which he's not seeing as to how he is back in Michigan now ... enjoying his retirement.

Scoreboard is tilting even more ...

[wally]

The plot thickens
Please let me drop some names too! I would like to clarify some things about Dragers. I was a DMT and anyone that allows an unqualified soldier to use one is an IDIOT. They are dangerous even for those who have received instruction on its proper use. Anyone care to tell me why? Hated doing dive support when they were used. Why was I only medical support when I was SF qualed? Because I wasn't dive qualified. Any accidents are thoroughly investigated. Just ask anyone who was there when Kevin Devorak died in Key West.
On the CIB, only those MOSs that are authorized to wear the EIB can be awarded the CIB. I was 11C before going SF and I wouldn't have been awarded a CIB had I been in Panama. Used to be the soldier had to be in combat for a certain time frame to be elegible. That was ammended for Grenada. If I had to guess I would go with Col Murph. I think we should take a poll

[Greenhat]

I've seen Col Murph's stuff for a while. I'd say he's the real deal, although a seriously old one. Not to mention, he's the one that went and met Joe Andrzejewski for a couple and got Joe to post here. A poser did that? I don't see it.

------------------
De Oppresso Liber

[Billy L-bach]

Guy, I dont know the name of the supply fella youre refering to, out here, our last 2 supply sgts have been halo qualified...

B/1/3
... I was on '23 with Bill Miatke, Tommy Scruggs etc for an RSU trip, then moved to '22 right as Belcher was doing retirement transition. (never really worked for him) Worked with big ole' Charlie Coates, Bill Howell (a WO1 now) and Ron Dye. Then I moved over to '24 right before going to Haiti, Brian Kimball was the tm daddy, I think he moved to Thailand after he retired... Then it kind of settled into Tiny, Craig, Ray, me and a few newer guys for about the next five years... Tiny is now over at language school, Ray is the Cheif on '14, Craig was team sgt when I left (loved working for him, I'm sure I made him pull out a few handfuls of hair though) but he has moved on to other things. I try to stop by when I am at Bragg picking up a class just to make sure they are doing ok. You'd probably know me if you saw me, I think you stopped by the team room to see Craig one day while I was on my way out.
Well... I gotta run, I rented Under Siege, Navy Seals, The Green Berets and Iron Eagle and you guys all should know how much I like watching them military action flicks!

Take care Guy....

[colmurph]

I may be old (61 in December) but just what is "Seriously Old"? LOL

[longrange1947]

Unfortunately for door kicker, it would seem that most of us are still active in this game. I can assume he can read my profile and see what I am still doing. It seems to me that he has just left the 20th, so who is the wannabe and he left a SSG? Hmmm - This isn't Sharkey playing wannabe again is it?

Next thing interesting is that he said he got to 7th in 90. Does this seem a confusion in dates as to his involvement with Just Because? Oh well I leave now and what his sun slowly set.

DACOR - I LOVE IT!!!!


------------------
Hold Hard Guys

Rick B

[colmurph]

Never knew that you could "Challange" the HALO course with a B license. I thought you had to have a D license. My old B number was 3680 but it wasn't USPA, back then it was PCA (Parachute Club of America) I guess somebody at USPA has the old PCA licencing information still on file though. Can't believe how high the numbers are today!

[wally]

Damn Col Murph
I wouldn't say you were old but you must been around when they invented dirt. Your ruck must have been really light, the commo gear must have been two cans and a string. Did your medics carry leeches? Course the wapons guys had the heaviest loads with all those spears and arrows. You might have known my first Bn CSM, Jack Joplin. Great guy but we had to ban him from our team room for the friday afternoon bull sessions. His dog ate our nurf football and he was never around when it came time to collect for the beer run.

[WS-G]

Originally posted by colmurph:
Never knew that you could "Challange" the HALO course with a B license. I thought you had to have a D license.
Latest info was recently passed to me by the current NCOIC (nickname "Lap") of the rigger shop at Camp Mabry, TX. Eligibility requirements for the MFF Challenge are now: Current jump status. USPA B License or meet the experience requirements thereof. Pass US Army Class II flight physical.
Of course, actually getting a course organized is easier said than done.

[wally]

Col Murpg
Iwould say you were old but were you around when they invented dirt?
I can see the equipment you had on your first team:
Weapons- bows and arrows
Commo- two cans and a string
Medical- leeches and linen
Demo- blackpowder and cocnuts
Had to raz you as it was officers who came up with certification for the teams. Had to prove I deserved to be on a team 3 times in a 7 month period.

[Ace]

Originally posted by William M Salter:
Pass US Army Class II flight physical

Hmm, I thought it was a class III flt Physical, are you sure?

ADMIN NOTE TO EVERYONE:
Hitting the submit button more than once will NOT speed up the process of your post.
TAKE YOUR MOUSE OFF "BURST".


[This message has been edited by Ace (edited 10-06-2001).]

[wally]

Ace
I have been getting a server error message telling me to resubmit

[Ranger002]

This is so beautiful.... My bets on Col Murph and Sir if it still gets hard at the drop of a hat then you are not old. :-)
William Hazen

[WS-G]

Originally posted by Ace:
Hmm, I thought it was a class III flt Physical, are you sure?

Army: Class II
Air Force: Class III

[Ace]

Originally posted by William M Salter:
Army: Class II
Air Force: Class III


Incorrect, Class III is used by Army

[WS-G]

Undoubtedly a recent change, Ace. I was aware that the so-called "modified" Class II — in effect for who-knows-how-long — had been scrapped at some point in the last couple of years. If the Army's going with Class III's now, that's news to me. Actually it would make more sense anyway.

Software's acting bizarre today.

[This message has been edited by William M Salter (edited 10-06-2001).]

[Ace]

Originally posted by William M Salter:
Army: Class II
Air Force: Class III.....

Well, I don't know about all the technical shit, but I do know from experiance that a class III Flt Phyisical is for Non-Rated (Enlisted) crewmembers in the Army.

[longrange1947]

Hmmmmm - Jack Joplin, he was a SFC when I was a SGT. Had a few beers together in Thailand circa 1971-73. NOW that was the fun days!

Col, you are OLD!!!!



------------------
Hold Hard Guys

Rick B

[Sharky]

Originally posted by longrange1947:
Hmmm - This isn't Sharkey playing wannabe again is it?

Not me bro. I didn't even know all this was going on. Wish I'd thought about it though. That would be the second time I'd riled Colonel Murph if it was. I got his blood pressure up last time while paying Josepy back a few months ago as 1stForceBadAss on Military.com. Who da hell knew SF was a freakin regiment anyway? LMAO

Can't we just all get along? NOT! Lmao....Hey Billy, now do you see what I meant about there being plenty of folks around here to check you out? LOL

Maybe a new forum called "The Sawdust Pit" where we can have these little battles. That way I won't be missing out so much.



------------------
F.I.D.O.

[Door Kicker]

well ace has all the info he requested about me.
Has anybody even bothered to call the number I provided yet?

And poor old colmurf, I guess your worst nightmare has come true. You have come down hard on someone that was not lying.

Yet I still don't have your SS# are you that afraid?

Are you done with your spy activity yet. Is it "checkmate" yet?

If you are indeed SF, I now now that what SF was back when you were in, and the professional level of SF today are two entirely different things.

You are the biggest baby I have ever come across that was claiming to be one thing, but displayed all the signs of a fake in reality.

You guys really kill me! you will argue about II or III class physical. Do you guys always wait to trip each other up? Is that shit really important?

I will be glad when ACE clears this shit up, so I can go back to lurking here. I'll just sit back and watch you guys try to prove each other wrong about regs and FM's.

From what I have seen so far, the guy that quotes the most #'s and regs, and drops the most names gets all the credibility around here.

You guys are all so up tight about being revealed for what you really are(cyber wannabees) that you jump on anybody that has not backed up one of your stories, or sounds as if they may one day challenge some of what you say.

It is funny that you ask for examples and names, but when I provide them you accuse me of trying to make out like I am a Badd Ass and that I know people I don't.

Do you know how silly it sounds to say, I know everything about you now dumb ass, we will shoot you down on site from now on.

I gave colmurf my SS# last night, and despite all his BS claims he has come back with nothing but I little ass kissing of some of the other members here.

Then not to mention all the rubber necks that are jumping on the band wagon and "handing me my ass" as you call it. Showing that they too don't have a clue, regardless of what they may or may not have done in the military before.

What are you guys going to do when ace comes back and verifies all that I told him?

"Sorry dude, I guess we were wrong! your comments are welcome here now as long as you say five times real fast that I am the coolest"

I regret the day I answered that guys question and shared some of my experiences after being challenged by some hot head Como guy that has always been treated like shit by 18 series guys. He knows why they all hated him now, It was my fault.

Another thing. For such detailed nit picking BTDT's you sure can't read very well. But I know why. You are so eager to be the first to respond to whoever you guys are attacking today that you fail to comprehend what is said.


Please qoute me once saying that I was involved in Operation Just Cause. Folks went to Panama for years after the conflict didn't they? Or is that info not revealed in your books you have read?

I remember the SOF only board used to have an ongoing thread about actual wannabees that was real funny. Everyone would find examples of somebody spouting shit and share it with the group. Ha Ha..... but that was it.

Now we have inspector gadget colmurf that knows all and can produce my complete background with my SS#. Even though he hasn't produced shit yet.

I expect that you guys feel that your post count directly relates to your penis size, so you better get it UP!
And if you can knock someone off the shelf while you are at it even if he is legit, so be it.

[Ranger002]

Doorkicker,

It's easy to be a badass in digital land. You may be for real but your attitude sucks. If your ever in LA look me up. I will straighten your shit out.
William Hazen
Notice how I sign every post with my real name. Nothing to prove or hide here...LOL

[Ranger002]

And for the record...If any man calls in another man's quals and is wrong....An apology is expected! I have busted many a pouge... I have also been wrong and apologize more than once...Murph? Doorkicker?
William Hazen

[WS-G]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:
...you will argue about II or III class physical.No-one was "arguing" on that item, DK. Info that gets circulated re: MFF Challenge seems to change as frequently as most individuals with a reasonable standard of hygiene change their underwear. Likewise, entry prerequisites are subject to periodic change, even as open-source publications bearing out-dated info continue in circulation.

The old saying "2 rabbis = 3 opinions" applies to discussion panelists as well. What are you guys going to do when ace comes back and verifies all that I told him?I'll probably crack open a beer.

[Billy L-bach]

Originally posted by GUY JONES:
Billy,

10-4 on the names, Craig and I were on 22 together...Did he ever mention our asshole tightening experience together?


as a matter of fact... I heard that story at a team party a few years ago... I cant remember what brought it up, but for the life of me when he said 'guy', it never registered that he meant GUY and not 'a guy' until I read your post.

go figure...

What are you doing these days?

[wally]

DK
I wouldn't expect you to spout off names of people you know without be able to back it up. My point is , if you did jump with the equipment you say, somebody needs to get burned for unneccessarily endagering your life. Yes DK my dick is small but I found the answer to that... I married a little oreintal girl so it looks big to her.

[Greenhat]

Wally,

Poot pahsah Thai, mai?

Pueying Thai dee tee soot...

------------------
De Oppresso Liber

[wally]

Greenhat
Wally poot pasah Thai nit noi. Chi, pooying kon Thai bein soie. Me ban tee Lamphun dtae Wally tee rat Ohio.
Soory but I have a hard time romanizing Thia into English, it is easier to write in Sanskrit. Figured I would go back in December to avoid the cold weather here. Can't let my eyes wander when I am there as my wife has ducks.

[Greenhat]

Wally,

Drop me a line before you come by. We'll get a beer. I'm in Bangkok.

------------------
De Oppresso Liber

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by GUY JONES:
DoorKicker,

Who got killed/died from a HALO jump in the 90's from 20th group?

You should know the name and location!




SFC Santa Cruz he was also a Mobile Police officer.

[Curtis Newkirk]

Wally,
You're right on track with the Asian girls. I married a little Korean myself. Centimeters is a much more forgiving measurement system for those of us with the Irish Curse. For those without the experience, the rumor is true: The AOR is East to West as Opposed to North to South. They make the strangest noise going down a slide naked!

------------------
Nuck
"Defensor Brewus"
Defender of the beer

[Curtis Newkirk]

Sorry, Double tap. Anything worth doin' is worth doin' twice (except 7th grade)

------------------
Nuck
"Defensor Brewus"
Defender of the beer

[This message has been edited by Curtis Newkirk (edited 10-07-2001).]

[donovan]

Originally posted by Curtis Newkirk:
Sorry, Double tap. Anything worth doin' is worth doin' twice (except 7th grade)



Too Much of the 1.25 Red Dog eh nuck???
<grin>

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by GUY JONES:
I'll just simply fade away on this one.

DK & ColMurph,

You both are on target!

ColMurph,

You have dropped some names where I will not touch or verify!

DK,

I know about 20th Grp and their exploits!

I bow out to this site all together!

Take care and be safe!


Hey,
No problem man. I was simply trying to share some of my experiences where SF support is concerned. Honestly never tried to ack like a bad ass. The stuff I have done(to an actual BTDT) would not seem that bad ass at all. At least where I have been. But then again, it wouldn't happen in the 82nd ABN either.
I can partially understand why an actual BTDT would get pissed off about a poser claiming to have done stuff he had not though. I just didn't realize folks made a career out of "eating wannabees" or had the time to do such things.
In my experience, posers step on there own dicks and will fade back into the scenery, if nobody pays them any attention.

I'll try to be real specific from now on. I will be sure to post all details and as many names and dates as I can remember. I was trying to be vague as I didn't realize it would cause such a problem.

If I acted with a poor attitude, it was because I was pissed, but then that is no excuse so I appologize to those that deserve the appology.

Take it easy guys

[Billy L-bach]

HEY AL...
I was looking on military.com, and found this profile...

Albert S Nelson
Self Description: I am from Alabama. I joined the Army for college money, but got alot more than that in the SF comunity. I am currently in 20th SF back in Alabama

Military.com Memberships
Special Forces From: 1992 To: 2000
7th Special Forces Group From: 1992 To: 1994


Now I'm not a smart man... but if you got to group in 1992 (as you posted on THAT website) how did you manage to participate in JUST CAUSE as a 7th grouper 2 years prior?

You posted here that you got to 7th group in 1990 (and took part in JUST CAUSE)...

BTW... saying you took part in Just Cause because US troops went to Panama for years to come is like ME saying I took part in WW2 since we still have troop stationed in Germany...


Now Albert, I dont doubt your claims...
-I believe 100% that you are a rigger currently working with 20th SFG...
-I believe 100% that you got your SOCNET nickname because you spoke before you thought... (you have done that alot---> ie. I am not a hot headed commo guy, I am a hot headed medic... go back and re-read the posts)

If you go back and RE-READ the posts, you will see, I added MY 2 cents because you started talking about support MOS's getting CIB's during JUST CAUSE... My initial post had NOTHING to do with your 'exploits' as part of the 20th SFG...
You offered that information for reasons known only to you... I raised a bullshit flag on support guys getting CIB's on 'merit'...
I STILL maintain, that ANYONE who holds/held/has/had a support MOS and claims they got a CIB because they 'went door to door' with some coolio' green berets is a liar! I dont care who it is, or where they work today... if that individual is wearing a CIB it is being worn fraudulently...

Your 'experiences' as a support guy in SF where initiated as a rebuttal... why? I could care less why...
You can make all the "Dragor" jumps you want... It doesent make your story any easier to believe.

I dont know what goes on downrange as part of a 20th gp deployment, I dont care. 20th group might let 71-limas do brain surgery for all I know. What I do know is NOBODY in 2d/7th SFG with a support MOS ever got a CIB...
The fact is, everything you post is accompanied by some type of factual gap.

Maybe I am just an unreasonable dick... If thats the case I truly do apologize. On the other hand, Al, you have always been the first to dispense with rudeness, disrespectfulness, and bad attitude. I didnt get hot headed until you got rude with me... once you got rude, game-on.

I am an easy guy to be around... an easy guy to get along with... but I meet sarcasm with sarcasm, and have no reason to feel like I should do otherwise. If I am out of line, I am CERTAIN that the administrators here will let me know, until then I will continue to call em' like I see em....

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by Billy L-bach:
HEY AL...
I was looking on military.com, and found this profile...

Albert S Nelson
Self Description: I am from Alabama. I joined the Army for college money, but got alot more than that in the SF comunity. I am currently in 20th SF back in Alabama

Military.com Memberships
Special Forces From: 1992 To: 2000
7th Special Forces Group From: 1992 To: 1994


Now I'm not a smart man... but if you got to group in 1992 (as you posted on THAT website) how did you manage to participate in JUST CAUSE as a 7th grouper 2 years prior?

You posted here that you got to 7th group in 1990 (and took part in JUST CAUSE)...

BTW... saying you took part in Just Cause because US troops went to Panama for years to come is like ME saying I took part in WW2 since we still have troop stationed in Germany...


Now Albert, I dont doubt your claims...
-I believe 100% that you are a rigger currently working with 20th SFG...
-I believe 100% that you got your SOCNET nickname because you spoke before you thought... (you have done that alot---> ie. I am not a hot headed commo guy, I am a hot headed medic... go back and re-read the posts)

If you go back and RE-READ the posts, you will see, I added MY 2 cents because you started talking about support MOS's getting CIB's during JUST CAUSE... My initial post had NOTHING to do with your 'exploits' as part of the 20th SFG...
You offered that information for reasons known only to you... I raised a bullshit flag on support guys getting CIB's on 'merit'...
I STILL maintain, that ANYONE who holds/held/has/had a support MOS and claims they got a CIB because they 'went door to door' with some coolio' green berets is a liar! I dont care who it is, or where they work today... if that individual is wearing a CIB it is being worn fraudulently...

Your 'experiences' as a support guy in SF where initiated as a rebuttal... why? I could care less why...
You can make all the "Dragor" jumps you want... It doesent make your story any easier to believe.

I dont know what goes on downrange as part of a 20th gp deployment, I dont care. 20th group might let 71-limas do brain surgery for all I know. What I do know is NOBODY in 2d/7th SFG with a support MOS ever got a CIB...
The fact is, everything you post is accompanied by some type of factual gap.

Maybe I am just an unreasonable dick... If thats the case I truly do apologize. On the other hand, Al, you have always been the first to dispense with rudeness, disrespectfulness, and bad attitude. I didnt get hot headed until you got rude with me... once you got rude, game-on.

I am an easy guy to be around... an easy guy to get along with... but I meet sarcasm with sarcasm, and have no reason to feel like I should do otherwise. If I am out of line, I am CERTAIN that the administrators here will let me know, until then I will continue to call em' like I see em....




Well I'll try to clear up much as possible with this post.

If you went to military.com, I think there you will also get confirmation of my MOS???? maybe not.

Now as far as dates. I say again that nowhere can you quote me as saying that I took part in Just Cause..... I have stated that several times now and it just goes to prove my point of people not reading everything before they jump to conclusions.

I originally entered the Army and 20th Group in 90 but went AD in 92, so yes I went to 7th Group in 92. I was in Panama with C/3/7 not during Just Cause. Maybe I got mixed up and said 90 for 7th but I don't think so.

Perhaps you are getting mixed up because I mentioned what some others did and received in Just Cause. I never said I did,(this I am sure of) Hell I didn't graduate HS until 89 and everything was over by the time I enlisted in 20th.

As far as SFC(last I new) Mario, I emailed a buddy and he cleared something up for me.
1st, he was a Rigger when he was in Just Cause.
2nd, he was pulled onto a team during the door to door sweeps.(along with others)
3rd, he was awarded the CIB because his secondary MOS(what he entered the Army as) was 11 series. He re-enlisted Rigger and was assigned 7th SF. But his end goal was the Golden Knights which is where he was last I heard. And when I met him.
My buddy also said that it was the brass wanting him to get it that made it happen and he only wore it on class A's for the most part because he didn't give a shit about it. Mario was already in the Golden Knights by the time I got to 7th. He(my buddy) also said that there were other support guys that were put in for it but the "technicality" of Mario holding the 11 series MOS was, in the end, the reason he was allowed.
Because of close ties between SF Riggers and the Golden Knights(alot of guys made the team from 7th because we jumped so much and our OIC Peters had buddies over there)
Plus we jumped at Raeford alot. Peters never wanted a chute to go out of date and wanted them all jumped then re-packed. This ment alot of Friday afternoons at Raeford DZ SP??
This is where I met Mario and he didn't tell me his story, others did.

Peters had buddies with the NC Smoke Jumpers (we gave them alot of equipment/ and a big wig from the SJ was ret from 7th. So we got their bird. Yes we made military jumps out of a yellow UH1H that belonged to the NC forestery service.

The SJ would also accompany us in Military aircraft jumps as well.

I did do the training that I said I did. And I still insist that it is not that big of a deal. I never got the feeling that team guys hated support, especially Riggers. We constantly had guys dropping off a case of Coors Light (drink of choice among 7th Riggers)at the shop. Sometimes for a favor one of us may have done, but other times just because.

Personally I really regret going Rigger. And the fact that I was lucky enough to get to 7th is the only thing that made my time enjoyable. I never felt that Rigger was a cool job, but others dissagreed.

I always volunteered to get deployed, and eventually I got requests from teams to send me when a Rigger was required on a deployment. This may be the reason that I did some training that you feel is a bit unbelevable.
And the fact that I may have not been totally qualified at the time and still so to this day(military wise) is most likely why I didn't describe the parachute jump with SCUBA gear correctly. I see now it sounded like I was claiming to have used a re-breather when infact it was nothing more than normal SCUBA gear which I am qualified to use. (logoed dragor)However normal water jumps(without SCUBA) were bassically routine and the logged ones I have are on Gatun SP(Panama) and Shark(Key West) DZ's. The SCUBA gear jump was a one time thing. I jumped on that deployment only and did so twice. UH60 -1C jump.

I have been on lots more deployments and some were un-eventful compared to others.

As far as CSM Rambo, I should have added(last I heard) he was at SWC. I have no way of knowing where he is now.
COL Pulley is ret and (last I heard) a civillian consultant in Hatti. Where his career was ended by a bogus sexual harrassment charge that was later dropped but not after he lost his command. He has a pony tail and is makeing twice what he was makeing on AD.
LTC ret Danny Greene is now liveing back in home town(I won't include where) and is one of the few associates I actually keep up with.

He has nothing to do with the Military but spends his time on the Ranch.
He does however find the time for the occasional jump in Opelaka with CSM ret Buddy Blue (Vietnam era SF and later 20th CSM)who runs a sky dive school there.

Some here may have actually heard of Greene and not remember. He was the one that instructed former president Bush to sky dive when he was still commander of Golden Knights. Bush mentions him in his book.

Well guys maybe this is the last of this BS. It sure is hard to get some slack around here!!!!!! I guess it would have been easier if I would have kept my cool!

But I still haven't heard from colmurf.......

[Nous Defions]

I tell ya what. I'm in Mobile, Alabama. I was in B co 2/1 ODA 151. I'm in the process right now of joining 20th Grp. In about 3 days, I'll be able to verify at least one side of this forum debacle. How about that?

------------------
"The Pride Outlasts the Pain"

[Jeff Rambo]

Nous: CLICK YOUR MOUSE OFF FULL AUTO!

Door Kicker, well ... seeing as to how He was at SWC prior to '97, would you honestly figure him to still be there?

I'll reserve my apology for somewhere down the road. I could play Storm Trooper too if I wanted to, it isn't hard to steal a name and research answers. Fact is: If a question can be asked in public, the answer can be found in limited time.

Maybe I'm having a Guy moment but something just don't seem right.

[Nous Defions]

Sorry about that Jeff. I kept getting some sort of "Internal Server Error" last night. I couldn't tell if it was getting through.

------------------
"The Pride Outlasts the Pain"

[Billy L-bach]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:
Now as far as dates. I say again that nowhere can you quote me as saying that I took part in Just Cause.....
.....I never said I did,(this I am sure of) Hell I didn't graduate HS until 89 and everything was over by the time I enlisted in 20th.

maybe you should re-read your very own post from 10-06-2001 21:23 ...

Originally posted by Door Kicker:
Please qoute me once saying that I was involved in Operation Just Cause. Folks went to Panama for years after the conflict didn't they? Or is that info not revealed in your books you have read?

Where you in high school or Panama?
Which is it?
Get your story straight Al...
No I did not get your MOS from military.com, YOU posted it here...
-I do apologize whole heartedly for suggesting your friend was a liar, but he DID have an 11 series MOS after all, didnt he....

Now you say you ARE gualified to jump normal SCUBA gear? How so? You said before you werent SCUBA qualified?
Who is OIC Peters?
Is he the OIC of your rigger shed? (The same CWO Peters who instructed you through 'challenging' the HALO course?)
Hm... how did he pull that off?

Help me out here bro... I want to embrace you as a friend but you make it so hard. Your dates just dont sync' dude...
If you were in 7th from 92-94 how did you jump with the Golden Knights at Raeford when you said you didnt even "challenge" halo school until 94?
Now if you were jumping MC-5 on Raeford, thats a different story, you may have even been jumping rounds on the auxillary DZ behind the airfield... but why would the Knights be jumping with 'ropes'?

Furthermore, all this 'jumping with the knights at Raeford, and talk about skydive Opelaka (which are both USPA member drop zones) why dont you have a freefall log book... If you challenged halo school in 94, spent "alot of friday afternoons" jumping at Raeford DZ... Why is it after 6 years you only have 'about' 80 freefall jumps? Thats it? I know guys that have been halo gualified for less than 2 years, and only jump when they arent deployed that have that many.
I still havent figured out how you managed to challenge the halo course without possesing any civilian skydiving credentials.... OR a logbook.

BTW, good story about breaking the rules again... civilians going with you on mil' air jumps? Now if its a sanctioned event (like a boogie with the GB club where they have paid and signed waivers) thats one thing, but, then again, your unit does seem to operate "outside the box" dont they...

-The people you work for are gonna' end up in alot of trouble someday...
-Please AL be safe around these people, they are going to get someone hurt or killed.

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by Nous Defions:
I tell ya what. I'm in Mobile, Alabama. I was in B co 2/1 ODA 151. I'm in the process right now of joining 20th Grp. In about 3 days, I'll be able to verify at least one side of this forum debacle. How about that?



Fine,
Both Chastang and Parker know of me. I have not drilled with B Company in a long time. I went to the Mortar Range with them around Nov of last year.

[Door Kicker]

Originally posted by Billy L-bach:
Where you in high school or Panama?
Which is it?
Get your story straight Al...
No I did not get your MOS from military.com, YOU posted it here...
-I do apologize whole heartedly for suggesting your friend was a liar, but he DID have an 11 series MOS after all, didnt he....

Now you say you ARE gualified to jump normal SCUBA gear? How so? You said before you werent SCUBA qualified?
Who is OIC Peters?
Is he the OIC of your rigger shed? (The same CWO Peters who instructed you through 'challenging' the HALO course?)
Hm... how did he pull that off?

Help me out here bro... I want to embrace you as a friend but you make it so hard. Your dates just dont sync' dude...
If you were in 7th from 92-94 how did you jump with the Golden Knights at Raeford when you said you didnt even "challenge" halo school until 94?
Now if you were jumping MC-5 on Raeford, thats a different story, you may have even been jumping rounds on the auxillary DZ behind the airfield... but why would the Knights be jumping with 'ropes'?

Furthermore, all this 'jumping with the knights at Raeford, and talk about skydive Opelaka (which are both USPA member drop zones) why dont you have a freefall log book... If you challenged halo school in 94, spent "alot of friday afternoons" jumping at Raeford DZ... Why is it after 6 years you only have 'about' 80 freefall jumps? Thats it? I know guys that have been halo gualified for less than 2 years, and only jump when they arent deployed that have that many.
I still havent figured out how you managed to challenge the halo course without possesing any civilian skydiving credentials.... OR a logbook.

BTW, good story about breaking the rules again... civilians going with you on mil' air jumps? Now if its a sanctioned event (like a boogie with the GB club where they have paid and signed waivers) thats one thing, but, then again, your unit does seem to operate "outside the box" dont they...

-The people you work for are gonna' end up in alot of trouble someday...
-Please AL be safe around these people, they are going to get someone hurt or killed.


OK, I will try this one more time. I said I never claimed to have been in Just Cause. I was saying that about people going to Panama since then to allow as to when I went.

I went to Panama after being assigned to 7th SF and well after Just Cause.
Again, the only reason I mentioned Just Cause is because of what SFC Mario did.

Golden Knights........
well we are back to you guys not knowing a thing about what you are talking.
Just because a bird takes off with jumpers be it Free fall GK Jumper or FF/static line jumpers from 7th SF. It dosent matter. The bird has to climb to altitude dosen't it?

We would all cram into whatever bird was going up next. I once jumped to GK Folker with an MC1-1C. the static round jumpers landed on the air strip.
The static square jumpers landed on the strip but the other end with the Halo jumpers. And the GK landed over by the parking lot right on top of their packing mats.
We had one mis hap when Maj Vandersomin GSC cmd, while makeing his first halo jump since leaving a halo teams years before, tried to follow the GK path to the ground. They made it and he hit the trees. They were ofcourse jumping sport chutes, he was jumping a MC5 that we had just placed in service. Peters was pissed because he ripped up a brand new chute after he had insisted on jumping the new MC5 and not one of the older XX(doubleX) chutes.

I am a qualified PADI open water diver no 9308548862. If you look up my number I assume you will see a country of origin...or atleast country of instructor OWSI-21319?

I said I was qualified to SCUBA dive. I explained that the reason I didn't describe the equipment correctly was because I was not exactly qualified(MILITARY WISE)to use the equipment.
And as far as I am concerned, the training I received prior to makeing those two water jumps w/t scuba gear was more than enough to qualify me.
If you guys don't believe me I don't care any more.
I have already given out my SS# to a sorry excuse for a man and God only knows what he is planning to do with it? This is more info than I want to give out. Plus he still has not responded since I did so. I guess his go go gadget inspector watch is in the shop.

I am not going to contine to dissclose personal info... especially with a hot headded MEDIC claiming that people are gonna fry. Yes Peters was the same guy......

someone here claimed to be in Mobile. I am going to email you directly. You are welcome to drop by my house or I could meet you with my DD214 to lay this all to rest.

I found this site along time ago and I forget it is here alot too. I am going to try to forget about it for awhile.

[Door Kicker]

well Nous Defions didn't provide an email.... much like another friend here Billy.

Nous email me if you want my contact info.

As far as I am concerned I have more than proven my case, especially compared to some others here. Some of you guys have accepted it and fadded away as this thread soon will.

Others, I suspect the ones who got their feeling hurt, still won't let go of the hope that they have "Busted" somebody. Which for some it will be their first exciting bust.
They are eager to be among the "coolest" members here that can claim "I eat wannabees for breakfast lunch and dinner"
Wow what a day that will be.......

So Nous Defions
contact me and you will get your bust, but not on me. On colmuf and billy the medic.

[wally]

Door Kicker,
You are a beaut.
Relook your original posts and maybe you will see why people are calling on you. I for one hate coin checks. I am the "hot headed" medic not Billy and I view it as one of the NCO creeds. Seek responsibility and take responsibility for your actions. I quess in your world the fact that a medic worries about the safety of others is uncalled for. When you said you jumpe a Draeger (closed circuit) and not the twin 80s (open circuit) without be qualified, it causes alarms to go off in my head. Jumping and using a closed circuit sysyem without the proper training is irresponsible and foolhardy. Re read your initail posts and identify all the discrepencies and you might see why people are on your case. Whether you are real or not? It doesn't affect my pay, chow or sex life so I could give a rat's ass if you are a poser or not. If you want to talk further

Michael Walters
740-452-2909

[Billy L-bach]

Originally posted by GUY JONES:
That asshole tightening event, that I spoke about...



No... I didnt hear that one.... I only heard about the SOT story.....

[grrlcop74]

Alright, this damn internal server error problem needs to get fixed....

[This message has been edited by grrlcop74 (edited 10-09-2001).]

[grrlcop74]

Originally posted by Door Kicker:

SFC Santa Cruz he was also a Mobile Police officer.

I can verify this part at least. I work for MPD and one of best buddies, Cpl. Hodge, was good friends with SFC Santa Cruz and upon his death received SFC Santa Cruz's corporals badge from his family. He died in 91 or 92, I can ask Roy for the specific date. As far as verifying anything else, I also have friends with the 20th here in Mobile and my email is listed, so fire away.

Kristen

[Billy L-bach]

This just aint fun anymore...


[This message has been edited by Billy L-bach (edited 10-10-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Billy L-bach (edited 10-10-2001).]

[WS-G]

Originally posted by GUY JONES:
... one year left before I can test for my GC (General Contractors) license.
GUY:

Out of sheer curiosity, what state do you live in anyway, that you have to have a license to work as a general contractor? We don't in Texas!

[colmurph]

Still haven't figured out if Door Kicker is legit or not. He did send me his ssan but I really don't want to open up another credit card account. Have no idea if it's real or not either. If all this stuff took place while he was with the 20th it could just be possible. Did a winter with them in Montana during Operation "Westward Ho" during 1966-67 with the 3d SFG. The Reservixts were using 40lb. shaped charges to blow holes in the ice at Rock Creek Lake above Deer Lodge, so they could go ice fishing.(Ice was about 3 feet thick on the lake)Plus they were using personally owned Ski-Mobiles. Didn't look to me like they worried too much about "Regulations".
On another note, any of you who were at Allbrook may remember me as the guy who tamed "Bad Bart" the local Coati who used to go diving in our Dempster Dumpster at lunch time. I was Theater Team Chief for SOC-SOUTH.
and worked in the downstairs portion of the "School House". I used to lure "Bad Bart" up to the sidewalk with fig newtons and got him to eat out of my hand. Towards the end of our friendship I was able to get a nasty tick off of his left eyebrow and get a flea collar onto him. I think he found a girlfriend and eloped with her.

[WS-G]

Originally posted by GUY JONES:
North Carolina, hooyah!
R

[Billy L-bach]

Originally posted by GUY JONES:

-Volunteering to sit in a room during a demonstration on room clearing.....


Bco. had a similar incident in FLA few years ago, the guy 'in the room' got hit in the hand with a 'blue-tip'... good thing for him you couldnt fire ball ammo in the mout city at camp blanding at the time...

Originally posted by GUY JONES:

-Flashbang that was suppose to be thrown in the room during the initial breach......


Flashbangs suck!
When I went through, on one hit, I was #1 man, we had been doing dry runs and NOT 'banging' the rooms... on the first live fire, with a shotgun breach, in I went, out of the corner of my eye I realized I was following in a SWAT-TX ... The number two man never said anything, just figured since it was 'live-fire' we would be throwing flash bangs...

Originally posted by GUY JONES:

BTW...The next time you talk to him, ask him about the Lake Havasua, AZ MTT. Specifically about the two jetskis and the Indian squaws.....


Could it have been Circa fall 92' during an MTT for some LEA's from Riverside...

Nope... never heard a thing about it...

Take it easy Guy...

[Ranger002]

Friends Romans Countryman Let it be known throughout the land that Guy Jones is getting fancy smancy with the HTML paste thingy LOL What more lies in store for us mere SOCNET MORTALS!!!! Saty Tuned LOL
William Hazen
Psssst... Hey Guy HTF did you do that?

[RLK]

RangerHazen

Find a pic you like.

type in where-ever it is, Http://www., or C:\whatever the adress is and then.

If you want go back to his post and click the -edit- button to see how it's done.

Regards, Rick

[JamesJanos]

DISCO RANGERS http://animatedgif.net/animals/otheranimals/party_animals_e0.gif