An FNG intro & question [Archive] - SOCNET: The Special Operations Community Network

Tracy

1 November 2001, 13:10

Face looks familiar, but the name doesn't ring any bells.

I do know there was NEVER any formal H2H Training in the Army. Ranger School has a block of instruction in City Phase. So I suspect a little embelishment.

I do know that local commanders at various times sanctioned local H2H programs, but the Army at large never had during the time he was in; or when I was in either (75-93).

Chiefc

1 November 2001, 17:49

I agree with Tracey. I worked at the Ranger Department 80 - 83. We didn't have any h2h instructors. The h2h was just part of the job. This guy may have been on "special duty" to a military gym somewhere. The term "Special Forces" has been seriously bastardized by the press. They mix all the SOF units in their reports and call them SF. Point is...who knows what he thinks SF is. For all we know it could have been some double secret, spy killer paint ball team.

Dax

1 November 2001, 19:58

Thank you for the information. His students say he tells them the techniques work because he "gutted", "broke a neck" in Guatemala etc. Not saying this isn't possible but I have never heard anyone ever brag about hurting or killing a person. Thanks again.

Ranger002

1 November 2001, 20:51

Dax,

Tell the dude he is a phoney and his dojo or mine will suffice to prove it. LOL
William Hazen

Ace

1 November 2001, 20:54

Originally posted by Dax:
he tells them......he....."broke a neck"

Don't believe everything you hear, it's alot harder than you think.

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Remembering and forever proud, those whose motto’s thusly read: "de oppresso liber, we do not quit, and we lead the way..."

Ranger002

1 November 2001, 20:55

By the way Chief welcome to the board. If you worked at RTB during 80 then you more than likely had me doing elevated push ups on the nearest Georgia pine and of course need I mention with the HAMMER (Sgt Swackhammer) who needs a H2H instructor!?! LOL
William Hazen 14-80

Chiefc

1 November 2001, 21:08

Well Ranger, good to hear from you. I've been here before, but it's been a while. I remember Swackhammer very well. He was an instructor when I went through (10-77). He was really a personable guy. How about George Ponder? George and I were good friends, but after I left for the "Q" course we never spoke again. Seems like this forum spends alot of time (too much!!!) weeding out the phoneys.

Charlie765

2 November 2001, 20:24

Now there's two names I haven't heard in a long time. Swackhammer and Ponder were RI's when I went thru Ranger School. One of my most vivid memories is the two of them demonstrating a H2H move where your opponent chokes you from the front, and you break away by turning and slamming your arms across theirs to break their hold and then slam them in the chest with your elbow. On the first demo Swackhammer choked Ponder. Ponder broke the hold and hit Swackhammer in the chest. Sort of like hitting a brick wall. They then traded places and repeated the move. When Swackhammer hit Ponder in the chest he knocked him backwards about 10 feet and out of the demo ring. The whole class went wild! Later in that session my Ranger buddy was having a hard time getting the over the shoulder throw right so Swackhammer used me as his personal training aid to show my buddy how to do it right. By the time he got the point I was having a hard time getting off the ground. I was later glad Swackhammer did that because two of our classmates were medical dropped (dislocated or broken shoulders) because their buddies were screwing up the same technique mine was.

mcdude

3 November 2001, 03:50

Charlie,...curious about your handle...\

Were you on ODA 765? If so, when? We might have some common acquaitances.

I did an MTT with them, once, a loooong time ago, in a galaxy far, far away.

Mick

Charlie765

3 November 2001, 22:37

Hello Mick, My name is Chuck Carter. I was in 7th from 83 to 86 and was the team leader for 765 in 1985. Rip Prine was the team sgt when I arrived. Rip is long since retired and last I heard I think he was back in the Keys. Left 7th in 86 and went to 1st SOCOM for two years, the SWC for two more. Finished up with a tour to JOTC as the A Co Cdr of the JOTB. If you worked with 765 during that time we probably do have some common acquaintances. With all the PERSEC concerns on the board I don't want to bring up too many names although I'll be happy to talk with you by email. I think almost all of my old teammates have retired by now although at least one is still active and doing well.

mcdude

3 November 2001, 23:19

wow, small world....
I guess that it was still a W-7 team, when you were there?

The previous TM SGT was one 'infamous' guy, first name Henry, if that means anything to you.

A buddy of mine from IOAC ran the SCUBA locker at Key West for Henry, back in 80-81.
The last contact I had with those guys from the 'old' team was I think in 83 or 84, when I saw Woods...he was doing SFLIC at the Center (read-"boondoggle").

I spent a year as a team leader at A Co JOTB. The house I lived in was across the street from the house that my old boss from Campbell had lived in, back in the 80s, while he was a team leader in 3/7. Needless to say, I miss Panama sometimes, especially Ft. Sherman.

I'll drop you a line sometime.

MD

Charlie765

4 November 2001, 00:09

Is this the same infamous Henry that ran the academy? If so I never knew he was the tm sgt for 765. Rip had it for quite some time before I got there. When were you at Sherman? I got there in the summer of 90 and got RIF'd out in late 92. Next to being a team leader it was the best job I ever had. Would have stayed in Panama if I could have gotten a decent job. Both my wife and I loved it there. Lived in Turner Heights right next to the fence with a GIANT wild fig tree 50 feet from the house. When it had figs on it the howlers used to gather there to feed and would serenade us every morning.

Charlie765

4 November 2001, 00:11

PS: Yes it was still W7. They didn't drop the scuba teams out of each company until several years after I left.

Greenhat

4 November 2001, 03:11

McDude and Charlie,

Either of you know an O named Estavillo? If so, drop me an email...

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De Oppresso Liber

Sapper12B

4 November 2001, 21:18

How about Chief Grigg?

All The Way

Charlie765

5 November 2001, 22:35

Sorry, didn't know an Estavillo. Grigg sounds familiar but I can't place him.

mcdude

6 November 2001, 02:45

Charlie, was there 96-97. I, too, lived in Turner, in the biggest house up there. Remember the 4 bedroom that sat in the northeast corner, farthest from either gate? That one was mine. I had a living/dining room big enough to have a bowling alley in.

Speaking of which....my roommates and I had a Super Bowl party in Jan 97, and had 60 people there at one time. We had two dart boards going, eight coolers of beer, and three grills cooking. We had almost all of our cadre, selected members from the rotational battalion, as well as the normal compliment of 'indigenous personnel' attend at one time or another. A good time was had by all, and the Pack won!

I was at Bragg, a couple of years later, and a couple of soldiers from that battalion were telling stories about 'the party house at Ft. Sherman'. I let them tell me all about it, then showed them the pictures. Their jaws hit the floor.

Grigg sounds familiar, but from Clayton, not Sherman. No, on Estavillo--not at Sherman, for sure.

Next to command, being a team leader in Panama was the best job I ever had in the army, without a doubt. Let's see...SCUBA dive, snorkle, jump out of airplanes (with pay!), SPIES, fastroping, helocasting, shooting all small arms made, doing CQB at Battery Pratt, mortar gunnery, demo training on the Chagres, Zodiacs off an LCE to Devil's Beach. Gosh, that was tough....Can I do it again, please??? Just think, I got paid to do it...kick ass!!

[This message has been edited by mcdude (edited 11-06-2001).]

[This message has been edited by mcdude (edited 11-06-2001).]

Sharky

6 November 2001, 14:16

Originally posted by mcdude:
Zodiacs off an LCE to Devil's Beach.

Getting seasick again just thinking about it. I was never so sick in my entire life...LOL Every Ranger on the boat was puking their guts out. The Navy guys thought it was hilarious.

I remember a hard lesson I learned in that little lagoon at Sherman. I was doing some snorkeling and checking out the fish on a day off when I decided to crawl up on a big rock to kick back and catch some rays. Being a country bumpkin who knew absolutely zero about the ocean, I had no idea the rock was actually coral. That hurt.

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F.I.D.O.

Sapper12B

6 November 2001, 17:47

McDude,

Grigg was stationed with me at Ft Leonard Wood at the Sapper Det. He was a 2/75 bat boy, 18D SSG when I knew him. He rotated back to 7th Group in 89.

longrange1947

6 November 2001, 23:12

You guys are making me want to go back to Panama. Spent 8 years there with 3/7th. Well my wife spent 8 years there, I had a few in other locations. :-)

Left there for the last time in Feb 85 to come to SWC after they canceled my orders to El Sal. Said it was a career move and that I needed to re new my citizenship. Spent a bit there during the party of Just Because. Then retired for the good of my tired old body and 23 years of doing the stupids.

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Hold Hard Guys

Rick B

Sapper12B

6 November 2001, 23:34

McDude,

Mistake on my part on the last post; Grigg was an 18C.

Charlie765

6 November 2001, 23:40

Hey MD, I know the house you're talking about! I know things must have changed a lot the last few years Sherman was open. When I was there Turner Heights was families only and we were all on 3 year accompanied tours. Still had some great team parties up there, and had a great time everywhere else too. First two years (as A Co Cdr) I could walk out the door of my office, take five steps, and dive into salt water. Some of the best spearfishing I've ever seen. Ever dive the China Wreck down the coast? There were some big fish down there. The last month I was there three of our guys (one of them the Bn CSM) went down there and all three of them got their spears in the same fish. It almost dragged the three of them to death before it tangle their lines and yanked the spears out. They looked like they had been thru a grinder.
Did you ever run into Jesse Allen down there, and if so do you know how to reach him? He was running Team 4 and retired right before I left. He and his wife (an Army nurse) were going to stay in Panama. Last I heard he was going to open up a dive shop in Portobello.

realpolypro

6 November 2001, 23:53

Originally posted by Sharky:
Getting seasick again just thinking about it. I was never so sick in my entire life...LOL Every Ranger on the boat was puking their guts out. The Navy guys thought it was hilarious.

I remember a hard lesson I learned in that little lagoon at Sherman. I was doing some snorkeling and checking out the fish on a day off when I decided to crawl up on a big rock to kick back and catch some rays. Being a country bumpkin who knew absolutely zero about the ocean, I had no idea the rock was actually coral. That hurt.

Ha! Russ Leach and I took Litts out for some "Intro To SCUBA" right off where the gear was given out (Not the lagoon). Russ and I are down there playing around but Terry can't equalize so he's on top. We come up and ask him what he was doing. He says "Watching that shark"... "What! What kind"?..."I don't F'n know, it had stripes on it's side" They'reeee Great! LOL! Then there was my pet Moray, but that's another story.

Or Looney in Colon

Or Bernisconi and Redfeldt in the jeep

Or....

Fun place.

Poly

Sharky

7 November 2001, 00:45

Terry Litts.....haven't thought about that nutcase in a while.

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F.I.D.O.

Ranger002

7 November 2001, 02:09

Originally posted by Sapper12B:
McDude,

Grigg was stationed with me at Ft Leonard Wood at the Sapper Det. He was a 2/75 bat boy, 18D SSG when I knew him. He rotated back to 7th Group in 89.

If this is the same Grigg then we were pretty good pals at 2/75
William Hazen

mcdude

7 November 2001, 02:28

Charlie,

Hell, I had forgotten about Jesse Allen. Yes, it is true. He runs a SCUBA shop/dive school in Portobello. The last time I saw him, he had just come into the post office, to check his mail. I didn't even recognize him, at first, then we got to talking. I forgot that he was on that team.

As far as getting ahold of him, remember the secretary at A Co, Jill? I think I may still have her email address around here somewhere. She and Skip stayed there, and opened a travel service. She would know how to get ahold of Jesse.

Hey were you there when the SERE committee came down, circa 87-88, and ran a course there? Zipper was the SGM then. It might have been before your time. If so, let me know...I need to email you.

Yes, for those who didn't get to experience it....Panama was a good place to be.

MD

Sharky

7 November 2001, 09:19

I take it we weren't the only ones who had some midnight forays into Colon. Always surprised me how many members of my upper chain of command I always found in those off limits areas.....LOL ie....Colon....The Black Angus in Old San Juan etc.....

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F.I.D.O.

mcdude

8 November 2001, 02:36

Sharky....uh,...I...uh...don't know what you're talking about. "Where's Colon? I never been ther! I don't know where the Hotel Washington or the Yacht Club are!"

The first time I went over there, my officer buds told me we were going to 'the club.' They didn't tell me it was across the bay. That was an interesting experience....

Besides, half of the Colombian working girls somehow made their way to Sherman on the weekends.

Charlie765

8 November 2001, 22:54

MD, I was never in Panama until I was assigned to Sherman in June of 90. When I was there A Co. didn't have a secretary. If Jill can put me in touch with Jesse that'd be great. I've been wanting to get back for a visit, so with her running a travel service and Jesse running a dive service I'll be set! Drop me a line when you find her email.

SERE in Panama huhh! That must have been fun! I went thru at Bragg right before PCS'ing for Sherman. One of the best schools I ever went thru, and one I would never want to repeat. I was the SWTG S1 when I went thru SERE. A couple of weeks before the class I was briefing the Group SDNCO and found out he worked out there. Spent an extra hour just talking with him, trying to G2 the course a little. Should have known better! Next time I saw him was at RTL and he "reintroduced" himself!