Serious PT

[Viking]

Yeah, I already posted this in the Lounge, but I don't want any of you ladies to miss this, since I searched "crossfit" and it seems nobody has ever brought this to the attention of SOCNET.


www.crossfit.com

Plenty of puke to go around. Grab a spoon.

[bslayer11b]

Shoot me a PM dude. I was in 1st platoon same time frame.

[Ranger5280]

A little gay but the excercises look interesting.

[BadMuther]

Just curious who in the spec ops community supposedly uses this......and interesting that they have a gym where I used to live in Washington.....

[90mm]

Last summer I was up at Crossfit North in Seattle and bumped into a Major from SF 1st Group. I didn't get the impression that the SF guys were committed to the Crossfit program...he didn't say.

[Silverback]

It seems that someone associated with crossfit is moving from board to board trying to garner interest in their program. We had some "PJs" come onto Army Ranger and start a crossfit thread. Kind of fishy that they keep infering that "Elite units" use their fitness regiment, yet no one has heard of it until recently.

http://img56.exs.cx/img56/152/untitled5ck.png

Now what exactly is being implied in this photo?

[BadMuther]

Hey Grape Ape, good to see you here!

[Massgrunt]

I don't know what a bunch of pictures of guys with guns have to do with pt.

[Silverback]

Originally posted by Massgrunt
I don't know what a bunch of pictures of guys with guns have to do with pt.

My point exactly. Seems like there is an advertisement push within our community. If the program is as great as I keep hearing why haven't we heard more about it ?

If this is not an advertisement push then why not publish the program specs in all the forums instead of insinuating we can't survive without this program.

[BadMuther]

Originally posted by Silverback
My point exactly. Seems like there is an advertisement push within our community. If the program is as great as I keep hearing why haven't we heard more about it ?

If this is not an advertisement push then why not publish the program specs in all the forums instead of insinuating we can't survive without this program.

Those were my concerns too.....it's made out like they have trained all these different elite units...it's also made out like it's a cureall for whatever that ails you....

I'm doing just fine with running and hitting the weights on my own at the gym.

[Silverback]

Originally posted by BadMuther
Those were my concerns too.....it's made out like they have trained all these different elite units...it's also made out like it's a cureall for whatever that ails you....

I'm doing just fine with running and hitting the weights on my own at the gym.

I am not saying it's a bad program. I am just curious as to why our "brothers" haven't posted the program and have only posted the web addy. Maybe it's some kind of fitness Amway.

[90mm]

Originally posted by Silverback
I am just curious as to why our "brothers" haven't posted the program and have only posted the web addy. Maybe it's some kind of fitness Amway.

Based on my limited knowledge, Crossfit is a philosophy of training, not a set regimen. But you can get a daily workout from their web address at no charge. IMO, it's worth a look, especially if you don't always have access to a gym.

I have had numerous contacts with Crossfit North guys and they are NOT Amway...they are very low key. Nick Nibler, one of the CN owners, gave me a free form tuneup on my deadlift, no charge.

[RsovRanger]

Like I want some guy looking like this to tell me how to get in shape or stay there.

http://www.crossfit.com/mt-archive2/John_Baumann.jpg

[Silverback]

Look out...I posted this guys pick on the last thread from this group and I got told what a spectacular human being he is and that he is an Olympic weight lifting coach...Bla Bla Bla.

[Chris_L]

Now who actually uses this, and which SOF troops, I would venture to guess "Metrosexual Commandos"?

What has this world gone to, I mean before we had the Snake Eaters, and there was a time during BUDS when there was no such thing as hydration, you had water with your meals.

I mean what's next, are they going to start incorporating Pilates and Yoga in BUDS and Ranger School, LOL.

[SOTB]

Originally posted by Chris_L
....and there was a time during BUDS when there was no such thing as hydration, you had water with your meals.I can't help but ask where you got the info on this. Not that it is or is not true, but that you seem to put it out there with such confidence....

[Petey]

I've done some of the workouts on Crossfit. They will smoke your bag!!!!!


I'm in no way connected to Crossfit but I check it out every. They have a philosphy regarding true fitness. They do lots of Olympic lifts and such. For alot of us doing power lifts after working all day at what we do is kinda fucking nuts, but they have some crazy exercise, in combination that can really smoke you. Alot of them are for time hack and force you to push yourself.

example: 4 rounds of 100m sprint 50 squats 100m sprint 50 push-ups, 100m sprint 50 crunches, 100m sprints 50 back extensions.

Check it out you might like it. I don't know about 'Metero-sexual commando' lol.

[quartz]

Myself and one other guy from my company have been doing the cross fit triaining for about a month. The program is better than some worse than others. The routines will smoke your bags if done at the proper intensity, but so will most routines done at a proper intensity. The bottom line is if you are looking to change up your PT routine crossfit would be a good candidate for a replacement.

[gsm619]

I'm a Phase OIC at BUD/S. Been doing Crossfit for about 8 months. Been to 3 coaching clinics.

While I was in IZ last year I had Crossfit brought to my attention by friend. After searching the website, looking at the movements, doing the workouts, I found this to be the most sound/sensible/functional stregth and conditioning program for SOCOM personel, and here's why:

During every op we did (DA) I squated, deadlifted, cleaned and pressed, moved odd shaped heavy objects from A to B, pulled my self up over walls, jumping over/on top of cars/barricades. Sometimes is was done carrying/helping carry a badguy/ teammate, always done with the usual 40-60lb LBV. The time frame of which I was at my max HR was any where between 3 and 30 min. We were gone for anywhere between 2 and 48 hours, called out at 1500 and 0300 to do any number of things. Nothing was ever the same, no one knew what we were going to be doing the next day.

Crossfit is a methodology that is BASED on these fundamentals: Highly varied (even random) functional, high intensity movements. The above paragraph IS VARIED/RANDOM, FUCTIONAL, HIGH INTESITY MOVEMENTS.

The bottom line is our community doesn't have alot of guys that are still in legit operating shape in the mid -late thirties. These are the most experienced guys and they all have knee problems, back problems, shoulder problems......because they don't work out properly. We come back from a land warfare training trip and do a 2 mile swim. They're diving and the command has them do an 8 mile run. If we operationally train to "Any mission, any time, any where" it would make sense to physically train with that philosophy as well (I.E Crossfit's Workout of the DAY) The workouts are rarely more than 30 minutes (we all complain about time right?) and because of it's work on the posterior chain (low back, hams, glutes) it will improve every phyical aspect of your life.

"Combat offers randomized challenges, that are largely anaerobic, completely fuctional, totally random, and mixed generously between lower extremities, trunk/core, and upper extremities. Any physical conditioning program that doesn't readily match and train for this environment is woefully lacking"

The above statement was written in one of the Crossfit Journals (they give you a book of all the journals at the clinics) If anyone doesn't agree with it, I would really like to hear why. This program will make us a MUCH more scary force than we already are.

This program is a great thing and the Head Coach Greg Glassman is MORE than happy to answer any questions via email/phone.

Please contact me via email if you have any questions.

[90mm]

GSM - I would think that Crossfit would be most appropriate for land operations. Have you adapted the Crossfit principles to your water workouts?

[Scotty]

Originally posted by RsovRanger
Like I want some guy looking like this to tell me how to get in shape or stay there.

http://www.crossfit.com/mt-archive2/John_Baumann.jpg

Hey P, they didn't say exactly WHAT shape... :D

Scotty

[BadMuther]

Originally posted by gsm619
This program will make us a MUCH more scary force than we already are.



Well, that's what's really important-that and looking good on the beach. :p

How did we ever perform before without it????

[90mm]

http://www.crossfit.com/cf-video/Josh_Greg-Fran.wmv

This video clip is much more representative of Crossfit than the photo of the heavyweight at the whiteboard.

[gsm619]

GSM - I would think that Crossfit would be most appropriate for land operations. Have you adapted the Crossfit principles to your water workouts?

90mm,
Water workouts. Besides diving, we do 1-2 mile ocean swims about 2xmonth. Getting your body to move fast in the water depends on how fast you can move your hips from side to side. A good explanation of this is given in Terry Laughlin's book Total Immersion. Idea being your body is faster swimming on its side, (resembling the hull of a racing yacht) as opposed to swimming on your stomach (slow ass tug boat). So to swim faster, you must rotate your hips to move your body from side to side. (ever see the hip fins?) The ability to control and explode your hips is the KEY to any sport/actitivity. This is one of the fundamentals of Crossfit. To develope explosive hip movement (kettlebell swings, Dead Lift, Squat, Oly Lifts).
Crossfit's principle is highly functional movements and is appropriate across the board. It will greatly enhance a sport specific program and help you operate in any environment.

[bull2808]

Pardon me for intruding Rangers and other Veterans. I am a personal trainer and have been for four years and that video clip is very instructional on how to destroy your spine. Those two can't even do dead hang pull-ups correctly. Don't place all your eggs in one basket is my advice.

[gsm619]

Bull2808.....Please explain why front squat to shoulder press is bad for your spine.

[bull2808]

Not the movement but the speed and constant pressure on their knees. Their necks are tilted back, therefore, their cervical section of their spine is out of allignment with the rest of the spine. Most of the movement is momentium. That is not bad if you show progression from deliberate movement to more intense and controlled movement. The pull-ups are way too fast and their legs are moving too much. Also their necks are tilted upward which causes a misallignment of the spine. I should have also stated that this program is not for the novice. Pardon me.:)

[bull2808]

Not the movement but the speed. Their necks are tilted back, therefore, their cervical section of their spine is out of allignment with the rest of the spine. Most of the movement is momentium. That is not bad if you show progression from deliberate movement to more intense and controlled movement. The pull-ups are way too fast and their legs are moving too much. Also their necks are tilted upward which causes a misallignment of the spine. I should have also stated that this program is not for the novice. Pardon me.:)

[gsm619]

Originally posted by bull2808
Not the movement but the speed. Their necks are tilted back, therefore, their cervical section of their spine is out of allignment with the rest of the spine. Most of the movement is momentium. That is not bad if you show progression from deliberate movement to more intense and controlled movement. The pull-ups are way too fast and their legs are moving too much. Also their necks are tilted upward which causes a misallignment of the spine. I should have also stated that this program is not for the novice. Pardon me.:)

Variations of the squat (Over head, front, back with/without weight) are the FOUNDATION of the strength and conditioning program of anyone worth mentioning. To argue against that would be to say water isn't wet.
But yes, doing any movement out of your control (speed/weight) could be bad. Dead hang pull ups have their purpose (isolate, more difficult) however, the kipping pullup makes it a total body movement, encompasses more athleticism, and is above all, functional. Getting over the railing of a ship, climping a wall, climbing a caving ladder into a helo, just getting your self up. The thruster (front squat to shoulder press)....whatever momentum you use is well earned/generated with the front squat.

Crossfit is for all levels, one must make sure to scale the weight and intensity, but don't compromise the movments.

The workout in the video is Thrusters with 95 lbs followed by pullups for rounds of 21, 15, and 9. Give it a try.

[bull2808]

Will do, thank you.:)

[BadMuther]

That video was all about momentum-what was that supposed to prove?

Doesn't look much different then the 16 year olds in the gym thinking they are about something because they half ass lift a weight and then let it crash down a few times.

[90mm]

There is a range of exercises, from static (isometrics) to explosive/ballistic (throwing a punch, hoisting a heavy ruck). They all have a place in someone's workout. Personally, I mix up slow/grind movements with explosive ones.

The problem arises when the 16 year old kid thinks he's doing a strict form bench press that compares to a competitive PL bench. But those guys in the video clip won't claim that they are doing dead hang pullups. And they would argue that their pullups are more "functional" and engage more muscles.

If you care what Clarence Bass thinks about explosive movements, check out the link below.

http://www.cbass.com/SPRING.HTM

[BadMuther]

90mm I just don't see a big difference with what these guys are doing compared to what others have/are doing. Just looked like they packaged it up and gave it a name.

Sometimes I did explosive and sometimes I do slow....sometimes I do full reps until I fail and then I do partials.....sometimes I do my sets with little rest between sets.

I learned all that stuff from bodybuilding and of course during PT at Batt.

I just don't get the hype.

[90mm]

BadMuther, you may be right. I can't say from personal experience whether Crossfit is unique & revolutionary. But I think workouts like Crossfit have military application.

At the Ranger Reunion in Tacoma this summer, I talked to an active duty Ranger who described the 2/75 agility test...and it sounded a lot like Crossfit...climbing a caving ladder, etc.

Anyway, IMO, it's just another tool for the toolbox.

[BadMuther]

Originally posted by 90mm
BadMuther, you may be right. I can't say from personal experience whether Crossfit is unique & revolutionary. But I think workouts like Crossfit have military application.

At the Ranger Reunion in Tacoma this summer, I talked to an active duty Ranger who described the 2/75 agility test...and it sounded a lot like Crossfit...climbing a caving ladder, etc.

Anyway, IMO, it's just another tool for the toolbox.

I was at the reunion too!

Talking with hooahs from the last few years I'm glad the Regiment realized the benefits of weight training. Seems like they have been training smarter, not harder.

The Tacoma News Tribune had a big article on the Regiment's new PT program a few...well, shit, a lot of years back.

[90mm]

BadMuther, you & I are from the same era. There was one answer for every PT question (at least in A Co.) - a five mile run.

Hungover? Take a five mile run.
Overweight? Take a five mile run. Twice a day.
Stress fractures in your lower legs. Take a nice five mile run.

[BadMuther]

Originally posted by 90mm
BadMuther, you & I are from the same era. There was one answer for every PT question (at least in A Co.) - a five mile run.

Hungover? Take a five mile run.
Overweight? Take a five mile run. Twice a day.
Stress fractures in your lower legs. Take a nice five mile run.

Yep, but you forgot walk numerous times across Ft. Lewis without food, water or sleep bro!

[90mm]

Yep, but you forgot walk numerous times across Ft. Lewis without food, water or sleep bro!

LOL. Yeah, but droning was almost like sleep.

[BadMuther]

At least in ranger School you got water. Anyone remember MongaDai's or whatever the fuck it was called??? I believe Col. Grange brought that one to us.

[Ranger5280]

Originally posted by 90mm

Hungover? Take a five mile run.
Overweight? Take a five mile run. Twice a day.
Stress fractures in your lower legs. Take a nice five mile run.

Same era...slightly different answer was 'Squad PT'. No one wanted to hear that PT would be conducted at squad level. A small unit can move faster and more pain can be inflicted with fewer witnesses.

I loved hearing it. Especially when I got my first squad. It was always a terrain run. For starters.

[90mm]

I was a kinder, gentler AT section leader...my tiny feet trying to fill the giant boots of Sgt. Pick.

I'd run our section in formation until we got out into the woods. Then I'd set an RP and let the boys run a couple miles at their own pace.

The gazelles would take off at sub 6:00 min/mile pace and my gorillas would knuckledrag at 8:00 min/miles. We'd meet up at the RP and return to the barracks in tight formation. Command never knew our secret.

[BadMuther]

Whoever the guy was that owns crossfit and called my cel, inviting me to San Jose-shoot me an email or something with the info.

[Polypro]

How'd I miss this? Crossfit will smoke your bags (Or I should say the movements/time hack will...a lot of others do this stuff too: Furey, Enamait, Peterson. Crossfit just came up with a name and a package, but it's free if you dig around the site). Try it. Try Tabata Squats: As many as you can do in 20 sec's...rest 10 sec's, repeat... 8 sets. Start with no weight :) Guy's, we fought and won wars with the old stuff...doesn't mean it was good, just adequate. Hell, they want to go back to a WWII style PT test because nobody does pushups in combat...well, prone under a truck, but that's just one. Unless you REALLY study modern exercise physiology and supplementation, you have no idea how far we've come. More fit, less injuries. Some stuff we did was plain stupid.

P

[90mm]

And...
Some hundred year old strongman methods of training are coming back into fashion, i.e. brief efforts, not done to failure, with heavy weights.

And some old time tools, like kettlebells. There's a lot of "new" stuff that's worth a try.

[Polypro]

I've got a 12 and 16lb sledge...and a tire:)

P

[90mm]

I've got a 12 and 16lb sledge...and a tire:)

P

Sounds like good stress reduction therapy...
...and a viable martial art. :D

[Polypro]

http://www.warriorforce.com/rossboxingvideoclip.wmv

P

[Debaser]

Agreed. While running, rucking etc. are important, there seems to be an undeserved emphasis on pushups, flutter-kicks etc.

While some of this is important for GPP (General Physical Preparedness), the Military might consider some other exercises and routines, and would do well to consult an elite organization, such as Athlete's Performance, overseen by Mark Verstegen. A quick aside--some of you might want to pick up his book "Core Performance" as it the most balanced approach to physical performance I have ever seen.

If I were running across brutal terrain, I'd be a lot more concerned with muscle balance than my ability to perform 140 pushups. The reason? Many of the spills and injuries people encounter are because of joint dysfunction--their bodies aren't absorbing shock and stabilizing correctly.

Food for thought from a wannabe.

[Wells]

Another Crossfit workout...

Hell's Bells (you'll be hearing them in your head soon enough):

100 Dead Hang Pull-ups
100 Push-ups
100 Sit-ups
100 Tabata Bodyweight Squats


My best time: 17:11

Here is the breakdown:

00:00 Start
10:03 100 Dead Hang Pull-Ups Completed
11:44 100 Push-Ups Completed
13:53 100 Bent Knee Sit-Ups Completed
17:11 100 Tabata Squats Completed

[Wells]

Try this... it only takes four minutes:

Guerilla Cardio (http://www.cs.unm.edu/~wneumann/files/guerilla_cardio.pdf)

After completing this you'll be introduced to the crawl, stagger, and dry heave sets.

Good luck!

[collin0321]

That same cardio plan was in the Men's Health issue with the "Rock" on the cover. He said that he did the same cardio plan to lean down for his last movie.

[BadMuther]

Agreed. While running, rucking etc. are important, there seems to be an undeserved emphasis on pushups, flutter-kicks etc.

While some of this is important for GPP (General Physical Preparedness), the Military might consider some other exercises and routines, and would do well to consult an elite organization, such as Athlete's Performance, overseen by Mark Verstegen. A quick aside--some of you might want to pick up his book "Core Performance" as it the most balanced approach to physical performance I have ever seen.

If I were running across brutal terrain, I'd be a lot more concerned with muscle balance than my ability to perform 140 pushups. The reason? Many of the spills and injuries people encounter are because of joint dysfunction--their bodies aren't absorbing shock and stabilizing correctly.

Food for thought from a wannabe.


:rolleyes:

Why don't you concentrate on graduating first before commenting on what the military should do?

[Debaser]

:rolleyes:

Why don't you concentrate on graduating first before commenting on what the military should do?

I'm sorry bro, and you have my respect, but this is my current career. I'm making the move to the 18X contract but functional anatomy, performance and Neuromuscular therapies are my domain. I know what I'm talking about. It doesn't matter if it's the Military, football, or a nursing home. The human body has the same design.

[Doctor_Doom]

Another Crossfit workout...

Hell's Bells (you'll be hearing them in your head soon enough):

100 Dead Hang Pull-ups
100 Push-ups
100 Sit-ups
100 Tabata Bodyweight Squats


My best time: 17:11

Here is the breakdown:

00:00 Start
10:03 100 Dead Hang Pull-Ups Completed
11:44 100 Push-Ups Completed
13:53 100 Bent Knee Sit-Ups Completed
17:11 100 Tabata Squats Completed

Hey Wells, hope you are well, and all settled in.

Keee-rist... I can do all of these fine, but I can't do 100 pullups in 2 days,much less 10 minutes. :(

I have a long way to go...

[BadMuther]

I'm sorry bro, and you have my respect, but this is my current career. I'm making the move to the 18X contract but functional anatomy, performance and Neuromuscular therapies are my domain. I know what I'm talking about. It doesn't matter if it's the Military, football, or a nursing home. The human body has the same design.

Dude, you want a cookie for being a college student???????

There's theory and practice. You are running off of theory.

Nothing worse then a know-it-all college student who has yet to prove himself.

I've read your posts here on socnet. They reek of a knowitall, I can do it better attitude.

The military doesn't need you to tell them what is applicable as far as combat fitness.

Sorry bro, I come here to read differing views from military vets about military stuff, not the 2 cents of someone who has yet to complete basic training.

[Wells]

Hey Wells, hope you are well, and all settled in.

Keee-rist... I can do all of these fine, but I can't do 100 pullups in 2 days,much less 10 minutes. :(

I have a long way to go...

What's up Doc???

All is well here in the triangle... Lots of PT...

[Debaser]

Dude, you want a cookie for being a college student???????

There's theory and practice. You are running off of theory.

Nothing worse then a know-it-all college student who has yet to prove himself.

I've read your posts here on socnet. They reek of a knowitall, I can do it better attitude.

The military doesn't need you to tell them what is applicable as far as combat fitness.

Sorry bro, I come here to read differing views from military vets about military stuff, not the 2 cents of someone who has yet to complete basic training.

I'm not running on theory alone. My best friend is in the Marine Corps, and I've worked on others in the Military. Many of you have similar joint dysfunctions. All have been grateful for the treatment and knowledge I've provided them. If you're not interested, fine, but this is a thread that was started about crossfit, a physical training regimen. That IS my domain, theory AND practice. I'll fully admit that you know more about the life of a Ranger, but you somehow think that I don't know what I'm talking about in regards to training? Now, who sounds like the know-it-all in that case?

I'm not trying to cause friction, bro. But your questioning my knowledge in this department would be like me questioning your ability as a soldier.

[BadMuther]

I'm not running on theory alone. My best friend is in the Marine Corps, and I've worked on others in the Military. Many of you have similar joint dysfunctions. All have been grateful for the treatment and knowledge I've provided them. If you're not interested, fine, but this is a thread that was started about crossfit, a physical training regimen. That IS my domain, theory AND practice. I'll fully admit that you know more about the life of a Ranger, but you somehow think that I don't know what I'm talking about in regards to training? Now, who sounds like the know-it-all in that case?

I'm not trying to cause friction, bro. But your questioning my knowledge in this department would be like me questioning your ability as a soldier.

Then state your experience then college boy. "My best friend is in the Marine Corps" doesn't count. I'd really like to hear what makes you a subject matter expert and why we all (and the military) should listen to you about military PT. And don't BS either.

[Debaser]

Then state your experience then college boy. "My best friend is in the Marine Corps" doesn't count. I'd really like to hear what makes you a subject matter expert and why we all (and the military) should listen to you about military PT. And don't BS either.

Certifications/training:
Massage Therapist, soon to be Nationally board-certified
Neuromuscular therapy
Sports Massage
Medical Massage, shoulder girdle, spine, lower extremities, abdominal wall
A.R.T. - Spine protocols
M.R.T.
Functional Anatomy

I still believe you're missing my point though. The fact that it's Military PT is irrelevent. The human body is the human body. A lot of you get shin splints, do you ever wonder why? Achy knees? Shoulder pain? It's all related, and for the most part, can be treated or prevented. Ever trip, get caught off balance and take a spill? Often this is due to your joints not stabilizing correctly and your perception in space (which is hampered by cervical kyphosis). And if your joints are bearing load correctly, you'll absorb the shock with a dysfunctional frame, and be far more likely to injure yourself.

[BadMuther]

Certifications/training:
Massage Therapist, soon to be Nationally board-certified
Neuromuscular therapy
Sports Massage
Medical Massage, shoulder girdle, spine, lower extremities, abdominal wall
A.R.T. - Spine protocols
M.R.T.
Functional Anatomy

I still believe you're missing my point though. The fact that it's Military PT is irrelevent. The human body is the human body. A lot of you get shin splints, do you ever wonder why? Achy knees? Shoulder pain? It's all related, and for the most part, can be treated or prevented. Ever trip, get caught off balance and take a spill? Often this is due to your joints not stabilizing correctly and your perception in space (which is hampered by cervical kyphosis). And if your joints are bearing load correctly, you'll absorb the shock with a dysfunctional frame, and be far more likely to injure yourself.


Nope, it's you who are missing my point.

So you are a massage therapist, yet to get National Cert, without a degree. I can see how that makes you a SME. So that puts my buddy's wife about 4 steps above you. She's nationally cert'd, has a degree, and her husband was in the Army, so I think that beats out your cousin's sister's friend's dog's owner once knew somebody in the Marines.

You have a condescending, know-it-all attitude, yet you don't have the life experience to back it up. Which from my point of view, makes your opinions not hold a lot of weight with me. Until you've rucked awhile, your opinions on what the military should or should not do are all speculative opinion.

You state that you are a prospective SF candidate as if that alone gives you some sort of credibility. Tell ya what, don't mind me, keep your outlook on life and see how far it gets you in the military.

[BadMuther]

How'd I miss this? Crossfit will smoke your bags (Or I should say the movements/time hack will...a lot of others do this stuff too: Furey, Enamait, Peterson. Crossfit just came up with a name and a package, but it's free if you dig around the site). Try it. Try Tabata Squats: As many as you can do in 20 sec's...rest 10 sec's, repeat... 8 sets. Start with no weight :) Guy's, we fought and won wars with the old stuff...doesn't mean it was good, just adequate. Hell, they want to go back to a WWII style PT test because nobody does pushups in combat...well, prone under a truck, but that's just one. Unless you REALLY study modern exercise physiology and supplementation, you have no idea how far we've come. More fit, less injuries. Some stuff we did was plain stupid.

P

I'm glad the Hooah's are training smarter and not harder. There was an article in the Tacome News Tribune awhile back about the new way that Batt was training.

I've always said how many pushups and situps do you do on the objective????

I'll have to dig up that article and post it.

[Debaser]

Nope, it's you who are missing my point.

So you are a massage therapist, yet to get National Cert, without a degree. I can see how that makes you a SME. So that puts my buddy's wife about 4 steps above you. She's nationally cert'd, has a degree, and her husband was in the Army, so I think that beats out your cousin's sister's friend's dog's owner once knew somebody in the Marines.


I'm certified, I just haven't taken the National Board test yet. That's the only reason I'm not nationally certified and it honestly makes almost no difference. She's four steps above me? This isn't a contest, but is she A.R.T. certified? Has she taken any medical massage courses with Ralph Stephens? Anyone can be a massage therapist, it's the ones that take the reputable courses that know a thing or two. There's a reason that A.R.T. works hand-in-hand with the Ironman Triathalon and the Olympics. There's a reason Ralph is one of the most respected practitioners in the nation.

And the point that you seem to continue to ignore is that what you do doesn't matter. Do you think your body has a different functional design than those that aren't in the Military?

[BadMuther]

You still don't get it. "4 steps above" was sarcasm. But since you asked, she has a degree in addition to her other training-something you don't.

Yeah, I understand that the functions of the human body are the same. My point is that unless you have been in the military, or you've spent a lifetime studying the effects of exercise on the human body-which you haven't-(More then being a massage therapist and going to college.) you really aren't in a position to comment on what works or doesn't work for a soldier.

It's like a civilian backpacker comparing what he does to what a 11b carries.

I'm pretty much down with you-My words are wasted on you, as pretty much all info is on knowitall college kids.

Please, please, please keep that attitude with you if and when you ever enter the service.

Have fun at socnet.

[Debaser]

You still don't get it. "4 steps above" was sarcasm. But since you asked, she has a degree in addition to her other training-something you don't.


A degree in what? Is it even a related field? The funny thing is, she probably wouldn't disagree with me in the least, and all you're doing is claiming how much more educated she is.

It doesn't matter what the civilian versus the military backpacker carries, in fact it proves my point even more since the Infantryman has a higher load and thus an even more vital reason to correct his dysfunctions. So shin splints become even more of a bitch, and I don't know about you, but the battlefield is the last place I'd want to have injuries slowing me down.

I'm done. You can't be reasoned with. You are wrong, afraid to admit it, and arguing with someone vastly more researched and capable than you on the subject. What you're doing is as retarded as me lecturing you about close-quarters battle tactics.

[Ranger1]

Mr. Debaser,

I don't have a horse in this race, and I am sure you are very knowledgeable about your chosen subject. Here on SOCNET we try to promote good lively discussions in regards to just about everything at one time or another. Additionally, you may very well be right in everything you're saying. That however doesn't matter.

BadMuther is a vetted member of our little community here and this is his house. Your posts to him smack of tacit disrespect. This has been raised here and behind closed doors. In short, your tone is not appropriate and has been noted as such.

Please tread more carefully here. If you do intend to go 18x, this board and its members are an invaluable resource to you. It would be a shame to see you banned after only 11 posts and id'd as a potential problem before you even made it into the pipeline and actually meet some of these board members face to face as your peers.

Good luck in whatever you choose to do.

[Debaser]

I apologize to Badmuther and the others.

Truly, I meant no disrespect, I can simply be a little overzealous at times expressing my ideas.

I hope we can start on fresh terms.

[BadMuther]

Rethink your attitude and drive on.

[Ace]

I apologize to Badmuther and the others.

Truly, I meant no disrespect, I can simply be a little overzealous at times expressing my ideas.

I hope we can start on fresh terms.

That gave yo another chance here.
Understand a few things; If you're right, by all means stick to your guns and don't back down. That does not mean act disrepectful to members of this community that have been doing the job you want to do, that is a sure way to get absolutely no help and none of your future questions answered, and possibly booted from this board.

[Debaser]

On the topic of PT training that would seem to come in handy for the Military, I stumbled upon this article (http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do;jsessionid=6A02CE02A99BABFA0C2EE01164 F1BA35.titan?id=468125). Hybrid pushup/pullup workouts, situp/jump/lunges complexes etc.

Might be worth checking out to improve endurance, explosiveness and coordination. Not to mention kicking your own ass.

[jakeshoe]

It doesn't matter what the civilian versus the military backpacker carries,


I would disagree with you here and point out that you are proving Badmuther correct...

Look at a military ALICE pack large, compared to about any civilian "hiking" gear.

Military pack sticks about 3 feet off your back in a short squat package.
Most civilian gear is tall, but is held closer to your back, and civilians have the option to use a waist strap to take a good portion off the weight of their shoulders/back, and load the waist/hips.

If you had any real experience in the military this would be common knowledge for you.

Now with your vast education and expertise, what difference does the configuration of the pack (short and thick vs. tall and slender) have to do with the strain on the body?

[Debaser]

Now with your vast education and expertise, what difference does the configuration of the pack (short and thick vs. tall and slender) have to do with the strain on the body?

I understand your point, and you're correct that the load distribution is different.

However, what I was getting at was that the way your body handles and stabilizes under any load, civilian or military, is the important thing. If hip dysfunction is causing your feet to evert outward, for example, your foot is not functioning like the tripod it should, the ankle is displaced, the knees experience valgus stress--in short your body is not operating at functional capacity. Injuries, whether repetitive use, or acute (like your body not landing correctly due to a fall) can result from this joint instability.

[jakeshoe]

I KNOW I'm correct and that the distribution is different. I don't need you to tell me I'm correct.

Answer the question:
"Now with your vast education and expertise, what difference does the configuration of the pack (short and thick vs. tall and slender) have to do with the strain on the body?"

Forget the waist strap, forget the type of shoulder straps, just the difference in the layout of the bag itself in relation to the body.

[Battboy From Hell]

I understand your point, and you're correct that the load distribution is different.

However, what I was getting at was that the way your body handles and stabilizes under any load, civilian or military, is the important thing. If hip dysfunction is causing your feet to evert outward, for example, your foot is not functioning like the tripod it should, the ankle is displaced, the knees experience valgus stress--in short your body is not operating at functional capacity. Injuries, whether repetitive use, or acute (like your body not landing correctly due to a fall) can result from this joint instability.

Ya know, it's all nice and such that you're theorizing about the this and that of injuries of military related activities.

What you don't have, however, is the big picture.

Load bearing equipment isn't designed for comfort or "health". It's designed to carry a lot of heavy stuff everywhere on your body that you can attach it.

PT wasn't meant to be comfortable. Carrying a heavy ass rucksack wasn't meant to be healthy and never will be.

The whole point is to carry more equipment to the objective to complete the mission, hopefully with as few friendly casualties as possible. You're talking about a profession that revolves around a very simple concept: Close with and destroy the enemy. When you're worried about copper jacketed projectiles cutting you to peices, trivial shit like your knee aching or needing a back rub rates kinda low on the "give a fuck" scale.

You want the golden oracle answer to injury prevention and rehabilitation? I'll sum it up for you.

Shut the fuck up, drive on, and complete the mission.

[Battboy From Hell]

I would also like to add something else, Debaser:

Do you not think the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines haven't already put years of research and effort into this topic?

I can remember when high caliber PHD types came to my unit and checked out our PT, watched us run and exercise, writing down pages of notes and such.

What I don't understand is how if the military has spent so much time and effort on these subjects for the last 100 years, what's a 20 something year old going to discover, change, modify, or suggest that hasn't already been looked at or covered at least a thousand times already?

Not getting injuried is more luck than anything, considering most of the injuries I've seen happen.

[Debaser]

I KNOW I'm correct and that the distribution is different. I don't need you to tell me I'm correct.

Answer the question:
"Now with your vast education and expertise, what difference does the configuration of the pack (short and thick vs. tall and slender) have to do with the strain on the body?"

Forget the waist strap, forget the type of shoulder straps, just the difference in the layout of the bag itself in relation to the body.

It would be better if I could try both on for comparison. I would guess that the thoracic and low back are more heavily engaged, rather than a more even distribution of musculature.

But again, what about the rest of my post describing how this isn't the issue?

[Debaser]

I would also like to add something else, Debaser:

Do you not think the Army, Navy, Air Force, and Marines haven't already put years of research and effort into this topic?

I can remember when high caliber PHD types came to my unit and checked out our PT, watched us run and exercise, writing down pages of notes and such.

What I don't understand is how if the military has spent so much time and effort on these subjects for the last 100 years, what's a 20 something year old going to discover, change, modify, or suggest that hasn't already been looked at or covered at least a thousand times already?

Not getting injuried is more luck than anything, considering most of the injuries I've seen happen.

I've always heard that big changes to the Military happen at a snail's pace, and advents like A.R.T., the Egoscue Method, and similar ideas (which I would add are used by the Olympics and just about every professional sports organization out there) are relatively recent. These are highly effective protocols, for anything involving physical exertion.

[Debaser]

Load bearing equipment isn't designed for comfort or "health". It's designed to carry a lot of heavy stuff everywhere on your body that you can attach it.

PT wasn't meant to be comfortable. Carrying a heavy ass rucksack wasn't meant to be healthy and never will be.

The whole point is to carry more equipment to the objective to complete the mission, hopefully with as few friendly casualties as possible. You're talking about a profession that revolves around a very simple concept: Close with and destroy the enemy. When you're worried about copper jacketed projectiles cutting you to peices, trivial shit like your knee aching or needing a back rub rates kinda low on the "give a fuck" scale.

You want the golden oracle answer to injury prevention and rehabilitation? I'll sum it up for you.

Shut the fuck up, drive on, and complete the mission.

I agree that it might not be designed for comfort and health. But the condition, function and muscular balance of the body will determine the ruck's effect on it.

Yes one would have to press on through trivial shit, and even agony, but what if you tore a hamstring? What if you were lunging over a log, stepped in some mud, your body didn't compensate correctly and you took a spill, tearing a hip stabilizer? Even if you CAN keep going, if you knew that you could prevent such things before they happened, would you?

[RsovRanger]

Prevent those bad injuries.

Don't enlist.

When you're falling out of a fucking airplane, shit's going to happen. Had a PA who ended up having a torn bicep from someone tossing their static line. Had a buddy with a broken back. Had other friends get screwed up. Some shit will just beat you down. Besides, when it's bloody, muddy, rainy and shitty there's not a damn thing your science will be able to do.

Hence why there are squad leaders who wake up in the morning and pop 4 motrin... why there are people that get medically boarded. Sometimes these injured folks come IN with the injury, and it just gets worse.

They already do everything they can to avoid injury. Shit's going to happen bud, it doesn't matter. Some bodies just ain't built to take the stress.

[Debaser]

Prevent those bad injuries.

Don't enlist.

When you're falling out of a fucking airplane, shit's going to happen. Had a PA who ended up having a torn bicep from someone tossing their static line. Had a buddy with a broken back. Had other friends get screwed up. Some shit will just beat you down. Besides, when it's bloody, muddy, rainy and shitty there's not a damn thing your science will be able to do.

Hence why there are squad leaders who wake up in the morning and pop 4 motrin... why there are people that get medically boarded. Sometimes these injured folks come IN with the injury, and it just gets worse.

They already do everything they can to avoid injury. Shit's going to happen bud, it doesn't matter. Some bodies just ain't built to take the stress.

Heh. You are right, shit does happen. I just plan to be able to prevent as much of it as possible by having proper joint function.

If I hadn't been doing corrective/preventative exercises, I would still have flat feet right now. All of you that do have flat feet, it can be corrected. It's primarily a hip dysfunction, and not so much the foot itself. If I still had flat feet, my life would be an unnecessary hell in the Rangers or SF. I'm relieved that I discovered how to treat it.

On a side note, I am walking out the door for Chicago, so I will be able to respond to follow-ups in 5 days or so.

[Joker]

trivial shit like your knee aching or needing a back rub rates kinda low on the "give a fuck" scale.



HAHAHA I know it's still early but this has got to be the quote of the day. :D

[jakeshoe]

All the education in the world but missing one of the principles of patrolling...

OK,
If you're forced to hold a board with weight attached out front of you.

Let's call it an 8 ft board and a 10 lb weight...

Would you rather have the weight at the end of the board closest to where you are holding it, or out at the end of the 8ft?

[Battboy From Hell]

Heh. You are right, shit does happen. I just plan to be able to prevent as much of it as possible by having proper joint function.

If I hadn't been doing corrective/preventative exercises, I would still have flat feet right now. All of you that do have flat feet, it can be corrected. It's primarily a hip dysfunction, and not so much the foot itself. If I still had flat feet, my life would be an unnecessary hell in the Rangers or SF. I'm relieved that I discovered how to treat it.

On a side note, I am walking out the door for Chicago, so I will be able to respond to follow-ups in 5 days or so.

You are missing the entire point of all of this.

The condition, function, and muscular balance of "the body" will be dictated by a wonderfully inconsistent diet, marginal water intake (often METT-T dictated), sleep habits similar to that of methamphetamine addicts, and conditions you can't even imagine.

Go right on thinking you know it all, bro. I encourage you to learn the hard way.

It's 10% physical, 90% mental. Period. That includes a lot more than just being able to carry heavy stuff and press a trigger.

You show up someplace acting like that. In fact, do it in RIP. Let that RIP cadre, who has probably been to master fitness school, know you know more about physical conditioning than anyone who has ever set foot on the Regiment compound.

[Battboy From Hell]

All the education in the world but missing one of the principles of patrolling...



Yeah, the most important one at that.

[Ranger002]

You are missing the entire point of all of this.

The condition, function, and muscular balance of "the body" will be dictated by a wonderfully inconsistent diet, marginal water intake (often METT-T dictated), sleep habits similar to that of methamphetamine addicts, and conditions you can't even imagine.

Go right on thinking you know it all, bro. I encourage you to learn the hard way.

It's 10% physical, 90% mental. Period. That includes a lot more than just being able to carry heavy stuff and press a trigger.

You show up someplace acting like that. In fact, do it in RIP. Let that RIP cadre, who has probably been to master fitness school, know you know more about physical conditioning than anyone who has ever set foot on the Regiment compound.

That being said back in the day I have seen PT studs snivel and whine on a mission and little guys suck it up and drive on with two rucks on thier backs. I am sure that aspect of being in the Regiment has never and will never change.

William Hazen

[Ranger5280]

That being said back in the day I have seen PT studs snivel and whine on a mission and little guys suck it up and drive on with two rucks on thier backs. I am sure that aspect of being in the Regiment has never and will never change.

William Hazen

True dat. And I've seen fat guys graduate Scuba School while triatheltes cry poolside.

[Ninja Marti 175]

Look dude, the fellas on this thread have repeatedly said the SAME THING--and that's that you just don't GET IT.

What amazes me is that you're presumptuous enough to keep on defending your claims of medical greatness ("I studied under the tutelage of blah, blah, blah.."). WHO CARES??? You ever brought that haughty shit, along w/ your fancy-ass certifications, to N. Schmidt Street and you would've gotten your head kicked in....and that's even BEFORE you were assigned to a company to meet your Team Leader.

Look man, seriously, listen to all these people you insist on arguing with. Little hint, they MAY KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT.

I'm a huge fan of SocNet and LightFighter but I've never been compelled to write a post until I read through your ridiculous rant about self-worth. "This is my specialty blah blah blah".....Good Lord, give it a rest.

And don't plan on going SF. All the fitness / therapy knowledge in the world ain't going to mask your condescending attitude (hint: there's a test at the end to filter people like you out).

There's a reason why it's called silent professionalism. Rangers can be loud and obnoxious amongst their brothers because they've earned it through shared misery--something you don't (and probably will never get to) understand, smart guy.

[Debaser]

Look dude, the fellas on this thread have repeatedly said the SAME THING--and that's that you just don't GET IT.

What amazes me is that you're presumptuous enough to keep on defending your claims of medical greatness ("I studied under the tutelage of blah, blah, blah.."). WHO CARES??? You ever brought that haughty shit, along w/ your fancy-ass certifications, to N. Schmidt Street and you would've gotten your head kicked in....and that's even BEFORE you were assigned to a company to meet your Team Leader.

Look man, seriously, listen to all these people you insist on arguing with. Little hint, they MAY KNOW WHAT THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT.

I'm a huge fan of SocNet and LightFighter but I've never been compelled to write a post until I read through your ridiculous rant about self-worth. "This is my specialty blah blah blah".....Good Lord, give it a rest.

And don't plan on going SF. All the fitness / therapy knowledge in the world ain't going to mask your condescending attitude (hint: there's a test at the end to filter people like you out).

There's a reason why it's called silent professionalism. Rangers can be loud and obnoxious amongst their brothers because they've earned it through shared misery--something you don't (and probably will never get to) understand, smart guy.

Your entire post has absolutely nothing to do with fitness, which is the topic of discussion. It was, however, filled with pointless rhetoric and machismo. You felt the need to bump the thread with this worthless post?

[TPD1280]

It was, however, filled with pointless rhetoric and machismo. You felt the need to bump the thread with this worthless post?

You trying to piss off the entire 75th Rgt, one Ranger at a time?

Dude, you were given a short course on respect a couple of pages ago, you apologized and were spared an early exfil.

Now, the thread gets bumped, your ego gets bruised and you choose once again to snap at someone who wears a tab that you don't.

You have some training in an emerging school of medical science, one that could potentially be beneficial to people on this board. Right now, your message is being lost because of your delivery. While your academic credentials may garner you some measure of respect from others in your field, they do not make you an authority in ours.

I'm not saying you need to genuflect or grovel. Rather, be mindful of who you are, who your target audience is, and determine the most effective means of communicating without alienating the target audience and losing the message.

[Debaser]

You trying to piss off the entire 75th Rgt, one Ranger at a time?

Dude, you were given a short course on respect a couple of pages ago, you apologized and were spared an early exfil.

Now, the thread gets bumped, your ego gets bruised and you choose once again to snap at someone who wears a tab that you don't.

You have some training in an emerging school of medical science, one that could potentially be beneficial to people on this board. Right now, your message is being lost because of your delivery. While your academic credentials may garner you some measure of respect from others in your field, they do not make you an authority in ours.

I'm not saying you need to genuflect or grovel. Rather, be mindful of who you are, who your target audience is, and determine the most effective means of communicating without alienating the target audience and losing the message.

I have respect for the Rangers, but that doesn't mean I should dignify his inflammatory post (again, nothing but empty rhetoric). He contributes nothing to the thread, instead using it to try and instigate, and *I* am the one who lacks respect?

[Atekomi]

and *I* am the one who lacks respect?

Yes!

Now, move out and draw fire.

[Ranger5280]

Debaser

Empty rhetoric? Hey kettle...you're black. The emptiness can be found in your text book approach to the issues. Good information, if it's factual, but the jump from classroom to practical application exposes a new dimension in learning.

Here's the bottom line. This is our forum. You are a guest.

[Debaser]

Debaser

Empty rhetoric? Hey kettle...you're black. The emptiness can be found in your text book approach to the issues. Good information, if it's factual, but the jump from classroom to practical application exposes a new dimension in learning.

Here's the bottom line. This is our forum. You are a guest.

Don't guests warrant respect? Marti's post was out of line, period. I had already made amends and was trying to engage in relevant discussion, and in he comes trying to stir a fire. Almost as if he clicked reply without even reading the entire thread.

[Debaser]

Also, what do you mean textbook smarts with no practical application? Who do you think I treat? Pictures in a textbook? Your body doesn't employ different mechanics simply because you're a Ranger.

The human body is the human body.

Imagine a wide receiver injured himself on the field, and was carried off to the sidelines, where the team doctor stated "Looks like you fractured your talus." Now, who the hell would respond, "What would you know? You're not a football player!"

[Debaser]

Meh, nevermind. This environment doesn't seem very conducive to free discussion, so I have no desire to participate anymore.

I respectfully withdraw from the forum. No hard feelings.

If there are any that would like to learn more about what I'm talking about regarding posture and function, check out the book "Pain Free" by Pete Egoscue.

And with that, I'm out.

[Gryfen-FL]

I know the thread got a tad bit derailed....

...Some people have mentioned working in pool time 'n stuff: I stumbled across CrossFit's little brother the other day. CrossFit Endurance (http://www.crossfitendurance.com/)

[Scotty]

Bad link, bro. Unless Bankle Americle is blocking my synapsis again.

Scotty

[Gryfen-FL]

dee-da-dee

Fixed now :D

[SOTB]

And with that, I'm out.Wow, looking at his post history, he really never came back. Which would make him one of the few who really kept their word -- I wish more would....

[ReconB2]

If there are any that would like to learn more about what I'm talking about regarding posture and function, check out the book "Pain Free" by Pete Egoscue.

Have read some of the Egoscue stuff....not impressed, hell, not even interested.

And with that, I'm out.

Buh-by :p
B2

[FlatBlack]

Eleven days after graduating from college I flew on an airplane for the first time to GA. A few months later I'm in the jungle trying to dodge the leaves my buddy in front of me is peeing on while we are on patrol. This thread reminds me of an epiphany I had while on that walk. "They couldn't do this." All of the professors with all of their knowledge and degrees, people I respected as having achieved 'the ultimate' by way of attaining PhDs, some who had inspired me, some who had belittled me. They couldn't do what I was doing. Great feeling.

I wish I could see this guy’s ‘Ah ha’ moment when it comes.

"Wisdom is knowledge plus the road." - Henry Rollins

[G8rRanger]

Actually, I have to come in on the side of the CrossFit "mentality". Crossfit is just one name. Gym Jones is another that works this way. Heck, Google Kettlebells and you'll get all kinds of stuff. Don't hitch to any one thing and this is coming from a NON-school trained practitioner.

CrossFit is a slightly different take on what we all know as "circuit training". The idea behind CrossFit thinking is a trend away from traditional "strength training", that uses either highly specialized machines to isolate muscles or free weights that essentially isolated muscles but with some stability/control needed as well. (None needed on a Nautilus: Drop the weight and the stack makes a crash but no one gets hurt. Drop a bar with 250 pounds on your shoulder and you've got issues, maybe.) Many Personal Trainers tend to like machines because they can control their clients movements and their risk. This is not all bad and genuine muscle development can take place, don't get me wrong. But NOT the kind of muscle development needed for the variety that military operations bring.

"CrossFit" tends to emphasize a few simple things, most of which have applications to dudes in military environments. As a non-educated or certified practitioner, I appreciate their emphasis on "core" strength, and total-strength rather than isolated "muscle group" development. I am too old to care if I have bulging biceps or a ripped chest. I have to stay in good enough condition, at age 48, to be able to backpack for 11 days at high altitude, or canoe 150 miles in 10 days, or simple things such as to lift the boxes of Christmas decorations from the overhead storage, or put mulch in all the beds around the house, or lift the lawn mower into my truck, or move furniture into/out of a dorm room. I am training for general things, not specific things.

The CrossFit exercise regimens tend to mimic the movements we do in the course of "life" as I detailed a slice of above, lifting, turning, bending carrying, etc. By combining a diverse range of exercises and practicing them, for time and with measurements, over a short, intense burst, the metabolic rate goes through the roof generating pretty solid aerobic benefit and strength at the same time. CrossFit does not emphasize muscle isolation, like so many machines and barbells do. The emphasis is on generalization and unpredictability, almost randomness. They focus on a combination of strength, speed and power. The bizarre variety of exercises and movements seem to replicate the fact that at any moment, one might be running 50 yards under fire with a can of 50 cal ammo in each hand, lifting them up to a position, then run and drop to another level to sprint forward to grab a downed buddy by the web-gear to pull him back under cover. Seems to me 3 sets of 250 pound bench presses wouldn't help prepare for that, but a round of 50# kettlebell farmers carries, followed by sumo dead lift/high pulls with 35# kettlebells followed by a rope pull of a 200# tire, with some cardio-inducing ecxercise in the middle of those, over a 20 minute span, might help prepare a GI for just such an occasion.

Because it's different doesn't mean it's metrosexual or any of the other adjectives I've seen. In fact, just the opposite. Most CrossFit guys I've known avoid the "mirrors all around the gym and tight muscle shirts and macho posturing that I've seen in too many gyms. They tend to be pretty low-key, focused on getting mentally and physically more capable. Sounds like a lot of the guys on here.

[G8rRanger]

Looks like the Army is coming around. Dudes, this is not a "new fitness craze". It's basic, fundamental and highly functional. I am glad to see this kind of thinking.


http://www.*********.com/news/2008/06/army_PT_overhaul_061408w/

[CAP MARINE]

ive mentioned this before.the Marines have their combat fitness routine now.even in bootcamp things have changed,where recruits are doing combat fitness,wearing partial combat gear,etc.even in my weight workouts i combine regular weights with routine use of dumbells and bodywt exercises.