How do you get on FBI's HRT?

[Double Tap]

Does anyone know the steps involved to get on to the FBI's HRT?

Do they really train alongside Delta at Fort Bragg's super secret compound?

Does anyone know the training they go through?...CQB...do they do go through any "high speed" insert/extract military schools....like Airborne, HALO, SF Combat Diver, Sniper? You know what I mean.

The reason is that I'm a sophmore in college and I'm looking at my options after I finish: military or domestic law enforcement. I want something to do with a Spec Ops oriented career field. (SEALs, PJ/CCT, Ranger) or FBI's HRT or something along those lines.

I don't know that much about HRT, but if anyone could explain the process one must go through after college to get there I would greatly appreciate it. I think you first have to become a Special Agent, but I'm not sure. If so, what would anybody recommend for the three years of work experience required after college in order to become a Special Agent (besides the military)?

Any Input would be great!

Double Tap...

[Operator43]

My information about the FBI in general and HRT in particular is rather patchy but I'll do what I can. First, you might want to check the FBI's site at www.fbi.gov. (http://www.fbi.gov.)
HRT is based at Quantico, VA. Considering that Delta and HRT have much the same mission orientation, I believe they do train together. I've heard the same rumors. In fact, there's supposed to be a (friendly) rivalry between the two units.
Hostage Rescue operates more like police SWAT teams than most Special Ops forces. I don't believe HRT goes through HALO or Airborne. I'm not ruling out Combat Diver, and Sniper is very possible. However, I believe federal law enforcement, although taking advice from the military Spec Ops community, trains more on its own programs and bases. Quantico is very well equipped. I don't think there's too much of a need for outside training courses for HRT, although outside practice (as with Delta) is certainly beneficial.
You do have to become a Special Agent to go on Hostage Rescue. You have to be an extremely good Special Agent to be on Hostage Rescue, also. I would write a letter to your regional office and send the same letter to HQ in Washington for information about being an agent in general and an HRT operator in particular.
Good luck, and hope I could help.

[Double Tap]

Operator43, or anyone else with suggestions,

I am wondering what would be the best route for the three years of work experience required for the FBI's Special Agent positions right out of college. I'm thinking on hooking up with the Dallas or Houstons Police Department's and get onto there SWAT Teams while at the same time being in a Reserve or National Guard LRRP unit. Does this seem like "the best of both worlds between domestic and military". Or is there a more advisable approach.

Any input would be appreciative!

Double Tap...

[Operator43]

That sounds like a great suggestion. However, are you planning to transfer out of the Guard or Reserve once you join the FBI?
Other than that, it sounds like a great plan. I'm positive the FBI will be impressed by three years experience on a Houston SWAT. However- how long might it take to get an assignment to a Tac Ops team? A year? Two?

[Dominique]

I remember reading some where (It was around 1987 so I not going to try and rember exactly where)that the combat diver school had trained some members of the FBI. I don't now which parts of the school the undertook though.

I also recall reading a Newsweek article where members of the HRT were used in a snatch op, to bring a Pakastani national back to the US( it was the guy who shot up CIA HQ at Langley).

From what I can gather alot of guys don't really think to highly of the FBI's SWAT teams, or HRT. I've got friends and co- workers who have done joint training with them, or attended training provided by them, and they were not impressed.

I can't comment on them though, as I have never worked eith them.

[LRSC Grunt]

You can both be in the national guard and be a federal agent too. Whoever told you different was wrong. My old CO, of which was double tabbed (SF AND Ranger), was a DEA Special Agent.

[Mike]

To Double Tap, you do not have to have work experiences if you have a college degree. My old neighbor was a FBI agent and he loved the FBI because it was easy for himt og et promoted- unlike other federal agencies/departments where there are 3,000 young political appointees with Ivy League degrees ruining our country. You must either have a JD or an accounting degree. Also contact the recruiting agent at your local field office. But I would never tell the agent that I wanna try out for the HRT, as Operator__ mentioned. The less the said, the better.

[Double Tap]

Mike,

I have read the "fbi.gov" Special Agent's requirements I cut/pasted this from there website:


There are four entry programs: Law, Accounting, Language, and Diversified.

Law: To qualify under the Law Program, you must have a JD degree from a resident law school.

Accounting: To qualify under the Accounting Program, you must have a BS degree with a major in accounting or a related discipline, and be eligible to take the CPA examination. Candidates who have not passed the CPA exam will also be required to pass the FBI's Accounting test.

Language: To qualify under the Language Program, you must have a BS or BA degree in any discipline and be proficient in a language that meets the needs of the FBI. Candidates will be expected to pass a Language Proficiency Test.

Diversified: To qualify under the Diversified Program, you must have a BS or BA degree in any discipline, plus three years of full-time work experience, or an advanced degree accompanied by two years of full-time work experience.

Isn't this correct. Wouldn't this mean you need three years full-time work experience in addition to a BA or BS degree? Please correct me if I am wrong.

Thanks,

Double Tap...

[WS-G]

Double Tap:

Going into an ARNG SF Group (long commute to AL, FL or WV, if you're a TX resident!) or LRSC/LRSD (one of each in TX: one in Austin, one in Houston) while you're attending college is a damned good plan. I'm ex Co.G (Abn), 143d INF (LRS) myself, from Feb 1981 to Apr 1985, whereafter I transfered to the Air Force Reserve.

Be aware that getting hired with any major law enforcement agency, whether at the Federal, State, county or municipal level, is extremely competitive and time consuming. The hiring process, from the day one submits his initial application, through the entrance exams (one or more written tests, usually at least one physical fitness test), the interviews (typically, one will have to pass at least two consecutive interview boards), an exhaustive (everything down to the size of your underwear) background investigation, and a final evaluation by a panel of top-level supervisors, typically takes at least an entire year. The vast majority of applicants, regardless of the agency in question, are not accepted.

In my own experience, I scored 94.5% on the U.S. Border Patrol Agent Examination, only to be told by the Hiring Unit shortly thereafter that "vision requirements will not be waived under any circumstances". I have a DVA of 20/200 uncorrected, correctable to 20/15 with glasses (20/12 with contact lenses); USBP demands no worse than 20/70 uncorrected in each eye separately and 20/40 or better with both eyes open, correctable to 20/20 or better. This requirement alone eliminates many applicants from the Border Patrol hiring process. The majority of Federal law enforcement agencies have similar requirements (e.g.: Secret Service, Bureau of Prisons, US Park Police) while some are slightly more lenient (DEA, Marshals). I'm not certain of FBI requirements.

I got much further in the hiring process with the Oregon State Police earlier this year: a score of 98% on the OSP Entry Level Test (more difficult and comprehensive in my opinion than any Federal tests I've seen), breezed through the Physical Fitness Test (OSP uses the same PT test as the US Army; at this stage, it's a PASS/FAIL test with no "extra credit"), passed the Primary Interview, then was invited back for the Secondary Interview a few weeks later. Felt like I did rather well, but still didn't get hired. Considering that I was one of just over 200 well-qualified candidates remaining by that point, and that the OSP was only going to be hiring 30 of us, a lot of other guys besides me got the "you may re-apply at any time" letter the following month. At the State level, especially if one is an "out-of-state" applicant, prior law enforcement experience is highly preferred. Being a former member of a high-speed/low-drag military SOF unit does not guarantee acceptance!

HPD and DPD, as well as a number of other departments in the State of Texas, are excellent, but even after getting hired, completing the academy, field training program and probationary period, expect to be required to serve on Patrol for at least two to five years before being allowed to compete for a position on the SWAT Team.

If you want the training, you may wish to consider taking the TCLEOSE Basic Peace Officer Certification Course ("Police Academy") at your own expense; this is a 16-week full-time course conducted at a number of universities and community colleges throughout Texas. I'm due to graduate this very course at Angelina College (Lufkin) myself as of 17 December 1999. Once you graduate and pass the TCLEOSE Licensing Examination, you will be eligible for hiring in almost any department in the State. Most smaller departments require that one already be TCLEOSE certified before hiring.

Angelina College Police Academy conducts a TCLEOSE accredited Basic SWAT Course two to three times annually. Duration is six days, and normal tuition is $150; low cost at first glance, however one must furnish all of one's own gear (carbine, shotgun, sidearm, ammo, protective mask, BDU's, tactical vest, etc.). Prerequisites are a passing score on a PT test (pushups, situps, and a 1½-mile formation run in BDUs and boots), current TCLEOSE certification as a Texas Basic Peace Officer (or higher), and a current commission (i.e.: you're either employed as a full-time officer or reserve officer, no "wannabes"). Training is conducted primarily by supervisors from the Angelina Co. S.O. and Lufkin PD Tactical Teams. While my own long-term LE career goal is to get onto an Air Support Unit as a pilot, the Basic SWAT Course is still my own "next training course" objective.

Feel free to e-mail me if you have any additional questions.

[This message has been edited by William M Salter (edited 11-17-1999).]

[Air Jay]

Double Tap,
If you want experience in infantry/SWAT tactics, do not go into the air force and join CCT or PJ for that matter. You will be greatly disappointed. CCT's are radio operators who happen to be air traffic controllers. PJ's are just medics. And these units get a shit load of schools only because the air force has the money. But these units in no way deal with anything close to what SWAT, HRT, SRT or SOG do.

Seals, SF, and rangers all have their own medics and communications men for those kind of assault style operations. PJ's and CCT's are just too small to provide that type of capability. That is why they are always behind the scene playing with the radio or setting up medical stations. (Kinda sucks if you ask me) Unless you like paramedic work or if you want to be an air traffic controller.

[Air Jay]

Double Tap,
If you want experience in infantry/SWAT tactics, do not go into the air force and join CCT or PJ for that matter. You will be greatly disappointed. CCT's are radio operators who happen to be air traffic controllers. PJ's are just medics. And these units get a shit load of schools only because the air force has the money. But these units in no way deal with anything close to what SWAT, HRT, SRT or SOG do.

Seals, SF, and rangers all have their own medics and communications men for those kind of assault style operations. PJ's and CCT's are just too small to provide that type of capability. That is why they are always behind the scene playing with the radio or setting up medical stations. (Kinda sucks if you ask me) Unless you like paramedic work or if you want to be an air traffic controller.

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Jay

[Air Jay]

Double Tap,
If you want experience in infantry/SWAT tactics, do not go into the air force and join CCT or PJ for that matter. You will be greatly disappointed. CCT's are radio operators who happen to be air traffic controllers. PJ's are just medics. And these units get a shit load of schools only because the air force has the money. But these units in no way deal with anything close to what SWAT, HRT, SRT or SOG do.

Seals, SF, and rangers all have their own medics and communications men for those kind of assault style operations. PJ's and CCT's are just too small to provide that type of capability. That is why they are always behind the scene playing with the radio or setting up medical stations. (Kinda sucks if you ask me) Unless you like paramedic work or if you want to be an air traffic controller.
Anyhow, if you like SWAT, then your best bet is to be in shape and become an agent. Forget everything else and just concentrate on that. You will get your shot at it if you put in the time and want it bad enough.

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Jay

[Gunpoint]

First, for Dominique...I find it very hard to belive that a Corrections Officer is criticizing ANY law enforcement agency's tactical teams, including the Bureau's. Its all the rage to FBI bash, and I usually just grin and bear it, but thats because its usually from guys on the street, not jailers. What you do is important, it is dangerous, and God bless you for doing it, but it ain't street work, and you're in no poistion to even suggest who's good at what, tactically speaking. Thats why I avoid criticizing uniformed patrol operations, 'cause the Bu doesn't do uniformed patrol.

HRT is good. No CT unit ANYWHERE will dispute that. Are they the best? Who knows, and who cares? Some jackass cop who thinks tactical law enforcement is his train-once-a month-in-cammies team will run off at the mouth about this FBI story or that. I really could give a flying fuck what the junior varsity thinks anyway, cause HRT is Big League ball. Next time his team goes to Germany to train with GSG-9 or Bragg to play with Delta he can comment on who's good at what. Until then, he can shut the fuck up.

The only potentially legitimate point you have is concerning FBI Field SWAT Teams. Quality varies greatly, and I have experience with only three teams, and one of them sucked. You could tell me a horror story about a small office SWAT Team, and I would beleive you. No dispute there.

But here in LA, its a different story. We have MORE call-outs per year than every other tactical team in Southern California except LAPD. These are call-outs in South Central LA, Compton, East LA, etc...not exactly nice places. We train 50 hours PER MONTH and our gear is top notch. We've trained and operated on a regular basis with both LAPD and LASD.

Clearly, LAPD/LASD are better than us, because they are full-time. But for a part time team, we are dialed in. Tight.

Believe me, we have our problems, and we don't always do things the way they should be done. I don't pretend that we are good at everything, and I fully recognize that there are alot of agencies out there who can whip our ass in more than a few categories.

But HRT ain't one of them, and neither is LA SWAT.

Out//

[jcollettusa]

I will second that, FBI's HRT is proven professional operators.

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Semper Fi

[abaustin]

1811:

On the FBI SWAT Team in LA, what types of jobs do you guys do so much? I'm not trying to 'FBI bash,' but I am genuinely interested. I was under the impression that FBI SWAT was primarly for federal warrants and such, and in cases without primary jurisdiction would only be called out if the agency with jurisdiction requested (maybe not an uncommon occurance?)

Andy

[Gunpoint]

The majority of LA SWAT call outs are pre-planned high risk arrests. The rest are emergency call outs for Federal arrest subjects that barricade, bank robbery response if SWAT is needed (hostages in bank), aircraft hijackings, rural fugitive searches, kidnappings, and extortion drop coverage.

We also train on Rapid Action Tactics, taught to us by LAPD, for "Columbine" type incidents. Those would be mutual-aid type of operations.

[Double Tap]

Air Jay and everyone else......

The post Air Jay replied to was approximately a year old...look at the dates of my posts and your posts...take notice of the years. Not complaining or anything, just an observation. I've learned a lot since that original post and I appreciate all of your comments. Keem them coming.

Thanks,

Dane

[RogueExec]

CCT/PJ's are not "just" anything, bro. True, they do not have the same mission as other SOF groups, but when they deploy with SEALs, SF, and others they do so knowing that they are an integral part of the team and that they're training is as solid as any out there. They ARE trained in infantry/SWAT tactics, not to mention nearly every other required combat training skill. They are taught by Army, Navy, etc. special ops and they provide an essential part of the equation. If they didn't, they wouldn't be deploying with the other SOF groups. I would be interested to know where Air Jay is getting his information, cuz it's skewed.

[Domer]

Air Jay,

"Just medics and just radio operators"! That and other comments in your post lead me to believe you do not have a clue as to what PJ's and CCT are all about.

[dsumner]

1811, I'm not trying to start a flame war, as the last line of my post stated. I can not say how any of the FBI feild office teams or the HRT rate. I have never worked with any of them.

I'm just relaying some comments friends who have worked or trained with them told me.

The "all" feel that the FBI has "my shit does not stink " attitude. I've heard that form more than one cop.

As I stated, I'm not saying its true,I can't speak from experience. The only people I tend to deal with are local police and sheriffs departments, state police,and other corrections officers.

The only time I deal with the feds is when we turn one of our guests over the INS or The Marshals.

As not doing street work, or I'm just a jailer. I'll be glad to let you spend a week with me. I work un armed in open an open dorm. Usually its with only one other officer. I have anywhere from 130 -150 inmates serving fom 1 year to 85 years.

I've got arsonist, rapist, murderers, child molesters, and anything else you can think of.

I'm with them 12 to 13 hours a day. I've had blood spit on me, food thrown on me, and all sorts of other fun stuff.

I don't have the option of usong a weapon if some one becomes violent, I've either got to talk may way out of the situation, or fight the guy until help arrives.

As I've said, I'm not critizing anyone. I've never walked a mile in your shoes, but you have never been in mine either.

Sorry if it sounds like I'm venting, but I really don't think A lot of people understand what we do. 1811 if you want to tall more drop me a line at my email address.

[Gunpoint]

Re-read my post, dsumner...I said this about your chosen profession:

"What you do is important, it is dangerous, and God bless you for doing it"

My point was this: corrections and tactical street work are apples and oranges. I'm not qualified to judge your work, and you are not qualified to judge mine. Thats all I said. Nothing more, nothing less. It was meant in no way to detract from the effort you put forth daily on behalf of all of us. I appreciate it, and I would never belittle anyone who so chose to serve their country.

Now, about this FBI attitude thing...there is obviously some dickhead Agent running around the country pissing off locals. I gotta find him and cut his balls off. He's giving us a bad name.

[dsumner]

Find him quickly or you will never be able to get a free dinner and a beeer fomr the locals. (LOL)

[mdb23]

Never mind, I made an attempt at humor, but it wasn't that funny (hence the edit).

mdb23



[This message has been edited by mdb23 (edited 12-08-2000).]

[Swat1]

OK, there is some bad information in this string (1811, Salter, Air Jay excluded). Hopefully I can help clear up some of the information posted here. First let me clear up a little about myself. #1 I am NOT an FBI agent. #2 I have a substantial amount of training and experience with the FBI. #3 I am a current SWAT team member with a multijurisdictional SWAT team.

I have been working closely with the FBI for the last nine years starting in Honolulu working with the FBI's FCI folks and SOG. I then got stationed at Fort Lewis and started working closely with Seattle's FCI Squad and SSG's. I am now a police detective in Oregon on a federal reservation and work and train substantially with the FBI.

I am good friends with a current FBI HRT member and friends with a former HRT sniper. I have been to the HRT compound on Quantico, been through their new state of the art CQB building, inside their team rooms, etc.

MOST of the crap you see on television about the FBI and locals is pure bull. I have met hundreds of FBI agents and other employees and yes some of them have "greater than thou" attitudes including one that I currently work with, however, this is the exception and not the rule. 95% of the agents I have worked with are very professional, easy to work with and many have become close personal friends.

As far as FBI's HRT, I am extremely impressed. They are a very capable and well trained operators, who have the respect of most if not all of the CT units in the world including Delta and Devgroup. Several of the HRT's members are former members of these very groups. My friend is a founding member of SEAL team 6 and Red Cell. He is a very professional unassuming individual who is humble, modest and has my utmost respect.

So to answer some of the questions that I can. You must have at least three years experience as an agent before you may apply to try out with HRT. They run a selection process that is based on the missions they perform as well as basic agent skills. I will not get into their selection process any further as I do not feel I am at liberty to.

Yes, they train with Delta and Devgroup as well as with other International CT and LE teams at their compounds, whether "super secret" or not and those teams train at their facilities. They have their own air and ground assets (I will not expound). They do not train in airborne operations, however do train and use waterborne operations. They have their own integral sniper teams and train with both civilian LE and military.

That's about it for HRT.

As for getting into the FBI, well Double Tap, you MUST have something to offer them besides a degree. Two of my agent friends in the bureau were applicant agents, one in Honolulu and one in Seattle. One day while sitting in the Seattle friends office he was going through applications received over the past few days. He says, "Jim, we receive 80,000 applications a year(this was 1996), now granted a quarter to half of those do not meet minimum requirements, but you just have to have something to offer." He reaches down and pulls two different applications out after going through a few of them and holds one in the air and says, "This guy has a four year degree, excellent grades, probably a pristine background but not a chance in hell of getting in. He's got nothing special to offer. Now this guy (holding up another application) has a degree, speaks fluent Mandarin Chinese and four years of military experience, unless his backround is bad he has an excellent chance". Point being, get something the FBI needs, something special, a language is very good, advanced computer skills, a pilot's license, etc. Make yourself stand out above the rest with a special skill that they need and keep your background clean.

Swat1*



[This message has been edited by Swat1 (edited 12-10-2000).]

[jcollettusa]

And that about sums it up! Good post Swat.

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Semper Fi