MOLLE vs. RACK systems

[wolflord chris]

I am looking at getting one of these two systems for myself and was interested in any opinions of people that have any experience with them. I would like any constructive critism that you guys may have.

Thanks,

Christian

[PAUL ROSS]

Go with the RACK man, the MOLLEis crap. I've used both and the MOLLE fell apart after the first PLF. the rack is great to jump and works a lot better with the RBA. The only problem is the RACK is extreamly hard to find and expensive when you do find one. Try "Tactical Tailor".

[Highlander]

Christian,
US Cavalry sell the RACK for 350$ as for Tactical Tailor(MAV), SKD tactical accessories sell it for 150$. Personnally I have a front opening chest rig(non-modular) by Sabre Industries for 130$ and I like it. By the way Specialty Defense(the company who produce the RACK) stop the production awhile ago. Hope it helps.

[Erick]

I've got the MAV, the new RACK variant, from TacTailor. So far, so good.

[wolflord chris]

Thanks for the input gents. You guys have helped me make my mind up. It will be RACK system that I will get.

Thanks again,

Christian

"Keep your powder dry!"

[MARK92A]

ALL,

KEEP PESTERING SPP (MAKERS OF THE MOLLE AND RACK) WWW.SPECIALTYPLASTICS.COM (http://WWW.SPECIALTYPLASTICS.COM) TO START RACK PRODUCTION AGAIN. THEY SOLD IT FOR $180, US CAV WANTS $350. CAN YOU SAY MARKUP?? I FEEL BAD FOR THE PEOPLE THAT NEEDED A US CAV MOLLE FOR $900, THEN SPP SOLD THEM FOR $500.
AS FOR THE MOLLE RUCKS FALLING APART, DID YOU HAVE A PREPRODUCTION ONE OR A ISSUE ONE? PREPRO'S WERE KNOWN FOR PROBLEMS.. ISSUED ONES ARE MUCH BETTER NOW. MORE MOLLE (BOTH RUCK AND VEST) IMPROVEMENTS ARE RIGHT ARROUND THE CORNER, INCLUDING A MUCH BETTER DETACHABLE BELT/FRAME SYSTEM AND A NEW VEST.

[Erick]

Re: The MOLLE

Had the pleasure of working with two 1LTs from 1Bn/1st Marines/1st MarDiv last week. Both were excellant lads.

They seemed extremely happy, from their perspective, with the MOLLE.

FWIW

[MARK92A]

ALL,

I TALKED TO A PLT OF MARINES A FEW DAYS AGO ABOUT THE MOLLE, THEY SAID THEY LIKE IT ALOT BETTER THAN THE ALICE SYSTEM.

PERSONALLY, I WOULD GO WITH A RACK FOR MY LBE AND A MOLLE RUCK. THE MOLLE VEST IS OK, BUT THE RACK IS GREAT. ONLY PROBLEM WITH THE RACK IS THAT IF YOU HAVE TO LAY ON YOUR BELLY, THERE IS NO WAY OF MOVING IT OR OPENING IT. ON THE NEW RACK (CALLED IMACK) IT WILL BE A FRONT OPENER, ALIEVIATING THAT PROBLEM.

[carpe282]

The Tactical Tailor makes both a solid front and a front opening Rack (MAV).

[MARK92A]

ALL,

JUST TO CLARIFY SOME TERMS SO WE ARE NOT ALL CONFUSED.

RACK = RANGER ASSUALT CARRYING KIT
MAV = MODULAR ASSAULT VEST

SPP WAS CONTRACTED BY NATICK LABS TO MAKE THE RACK, ALONG WITH THE RANGER MOLLE FOR THE 75TH RANGERS. TACTICAL TAILOR MAKES THE MAV WICH IS SIMILAR, BUT NOT THE SAME AS THE RACK.

AND YES, THE RANGER MOLLE IS DIFFERENT FROM THE REGULAR MOLLE THAT SPP SELLS NOW.

[Tongo47]

Hello,

I am thinking of investing in a MOLLE pack. Is it worth the money? Can the SAW model of the MOLLE hold M-240 belts (.308)in the pouches? The reason I ask is that I am currently using the standard issue SAW pouches to carry 100rd (.308) assault plastic boxes.

Thanks for any advice.

[MARK92A]

I cant comment specifically on the 240 belts fitting in the MOLLE SAW pouches, but the green 200 round SAW ammo drums fit in the MOLLE SAW pouches just like they fit in the ALICE ones. I would imagine it would fit.

If you are going to do any serious humping, Id go with the MOLLE. If you compare cost per item in ALICE and MOLLE, it comes out pretty close.

Some key points of the MOLLE are: It is much more comfortable when used correctly. You can tailor it to your specific mission and squad position which is something thats tough to do with the IIFS/ALICE system. The Marines have complained to the Marine Corps Times that there are too many pouches and things to loose, but thats an attention to detail thing in my mind. You can loose ALICE pouches also..

The future of loadbearing is in MOLLE. Yes, there are some kinks still being worked out, but thats the case with just about anything thats new to the inventory. Thats why there are A1/A2 versions of items... The MOLLE has undergone numerous changes from the original 1997 system, and it is still undergoing improvements.

There has been alot of discussion of the MOLLE/RACK on Gearnet. Do a search of the older postings..

Hope this helps!

[galaxy chief]

Here is another question regarding MOLLE gear. Can the sustainment pouches be used on the patrol pack? I have the pack and am intersted in getting a little more capacity in the pack.

Thanks

[murphquake]

Yes, the sustainment pockets can go on the patrol pack. Download the manual from SPP at <http://www.specialtydefense.com/> just go to the MOLLE section. HTH!
-bill

[galaxy chief]

Thanks murph.

[MARK92A]

All MOLLE and RACK pouches can be put anywhere there is MOLLE attachment webbing..
You can hang M16/203/9/249/any other pouch on anything that has the attachment webbing..

[MARK92A]

Double tap....

[This message has been edited by MARK92A (edited 12-20-2000).]

[murphquake]

no prob chief.... mark is right... that the great thing about MOLLE im waiting for a pair of sustainment pockets right now for the same reason... out
-bill

[galaxy chief]

Thanks for the info guys. I just wasn't sure if there was phyisicly enough room on the small pack for the pouches.

Thanks again

[MARK92A]

Just like Murph said, go download the manual, it answers alot of questions. Hey, it's free.. Cant beat that!

--Mark

[10122]

Just to add my .02 The second generation MOLLE System is beginning it's initial fielding to the USMC, known as MOLLE II. The Patrol Pack has been re-designed. One small improvement is that another row of webbing is added to the side of the pack allowing for more space to hang pockets from. This will definetly make hanging the sustainment pouches alot easier then it is right now.

[This message has been edited by 10122 (edited 12-21-2000).]

[This message has been edited by 10122 (edited 12-21-2000).]

[murphquake]

an idea where theres more info on this MOLLE II? or at least pics...
where exactly is this extra webbing located. TIA!
-bill

[10122]

Murphquake,

No pics yet. Working on getting it. Word is that something should be avail by the new year. Will let ya know soon as i hear anything.

If you look at the side of the Patrol Pack the extra row of webbing will be on the front pocket. Inline with the 3rd row of webbing on the main body of the pack.

[murphquake]

10122,
Gotcha, thanks! I was wondering why there wasn't any there to begin with. Looky there they made sense. Thanks again! Keep the forum updated on the rest of it, I know I'm not the only one interested =-)
-bill

[sghilliard]

I just talked with someone at SP and they said that their site would be updated over the holidays. He said if he got the samples from the factory, it would contain info, including pics, of MOLLE II (i.e. fixed waist belt, etc.).

[MARK92A]

SGT H,

Good deal. Perhaps 10122 can help us out here with some pics from where ever he gets them from..

With everyone working their ends, we should be able to have some solid info on it! http://www.specialoperations.com/ubboard/smile.gif

[jinX]

To anyone here who owns a RACK - how is it in long-distance operations (i.e. Long Range Surveillance, or deep penetration)? It is called an "Assault Kit". Does this mean it is only good for use in short, direct action operations?

I also understand that the SPP version is now on issue to members of the 75th; are other units using the RACK also? Any of you SF, FR, or SEAL Operators using this piece of kit? Just curious about your opinions on it, as I may be able to acquire one for half the price advertised on SPP's site.

[sghilliard]

I'm not SF or Ranger, but I do use my RACK all the time for different kinds of training and field exercises. I would say that it is best for short range assault type ops, but I've used it for up to a week of patroling with a TT modified issue ruck. When I have to deploy for those one to three month deployments I take the issue LBE. Mostly for uniformity concerns, but also because it can carry more kit on your person without having to keep going back to the ruck to refill. I think that the RACK really stands out in it's system of modular components. Being able to infinitely adjust it for each mission is a real plus. BTW, beware of RACK imposters. All are not created equal.

[jinX]

Thanks for the info, sghilliard. When you say issue LBE, do you mean the ALICE equipment w/ standard ammo pouches, canteens, etc.?

I'm not worried about impostors, this one's almost straight from the source (once removed), and I trust him http://www.specialoperations.com/ubboard/smile.gif

[bubba]

How long do you need to live off your lce. If you are going out for two or three nights without your house (ruck) then not only should you use an lce/lbv with but ruck and a lot of pouches for shit, but your first sergent needs to kick your cdr in his fourth point of contact. Point being in a fire fight where you drop rucks, all you need is bullets and hand grenades with a couple exteras like nods and water in a camel back. All that other stuff (poncho liner,MRE's,ww top, FM's, etc.....) can wait untill after the fight. It will make you lighter and easier to move if wounded.

------------------
RLTW

[jinX]

Thanks, Bubba. What you said certainly makes sense. I guess I should have phrased the question this way:

When you wear the RACK, do you tend to wear the full ruck with it, or just the day pack?

[bubba]

Once again it is METT-T dependent. I have gone on missions where I wear my RACK with assault pack and ruck sack and some times both (assault pack fastexed on top). In the 101st we sometimes sling load our rucksacks after we secure the LZ, and I just take the assault pack for a short sustainment load plus extras like CLS bag and/or extra rounds for the MG's or mortars. But as said in an earlier post, the RACK is superb in that I can tailor my load to the mission much easier.

------------------
RLTW

[sghilliard]

When I talked about living off my LBE I was refering more to operations like the Balkans where you have a formation in front of Top every morning with your full battle rattle. You might drive through the towns on a daily bases using up all the chemlights, MRE's, and other assorted crap that you keep in your buttpack. With the RACK I don't have as much room for all the day to day crap.

Like Bubba said, I've used it with all those combinations. Usually we have to stick with the issue ruck, but can usually throw the 3 day on top if I know I'm going to be able to dump the ruck at an sp or rv.

[This message has been edited by sghilliard (edited 01-02-2001).]

[MARK92A]

The RACK is a chest webbing. As issued, it holds 8 M16 Mags, 4 Frags, a PRC 126, a SABER, and a 1 QT canteen, plus whatever you want in the Leg bag. The MOLLE vest can hold the same items and vice versa.

The 75th uses the RACK as their LBE and a special Ranger Version of the MOLLE ruck with some cool improvments we will see soon as MOLLE2. The beauty of the MOLLE/RACK system is you can add/take off/change the pockets to fit your mission needs.

Personally, I have seen Mounted Infantry use the RACK and MOLLE Patrol pack as their LBE and the MOLLE ruck for sustainment. Other guys I know use the MOLLE vest and the MOLLE ruck. There is no right/wrong answer with the MOLLE/RACK, its whatever works for you.

The RACK rides on your chest as opposed to the old ALICE Y straps that rode on the waist area. The MOLLE vest is a LBV.

Dont get caught up on the name. The name was just NATICK's idea that sounded good to the Rangers.

Also, on the RACK imposters, be wary what you buy from US CAV. BH has made RACK copies that dont meet the specs of the MOLLE/RACK system. Plus, they prices are $350. SPP can get you a REAL one at $180.

[sghilliard]

Exactly the imposter I was talking about.... thanks Mark. BTW has anyone tried to order the Interceptor from PB on a personel basis? I've sent them a couple of e-mails and haven't heard back from them. I guess it's the holidays.
Stephen

[This message has been edited by sghilliard (edited 01-03-2001).]

[MARK92A]

PB only sells to military, or those who are in it. Call them up, the lady you want to speak to is Mischell.

Check the US CAV RACK posting for the whole story on the imposter BH RACK..

--Mark

[MARK92A]

Sorry, double tap..

[This message has been edited by MARK92A (edited 01-03-2001).]