Family Tradition or a Fresh Start?

[ASByron]

For a while now I've thought about going either PSYOP or MI, and as I've done more and more research I've come to think MI is where I belong. However there is still the thought of going for 18A...

My father was a Special Forces sniper in Vietnam, I was asked during AFROTC if I had considered applying for CSR, and y Army recruiter kept asking me about Special Forces. I guess I have two big concerns that have held me back from really being confident in thinking SF:

1) What kind of career options do SF officers have after they leave the Army? From what I've read there are a lot of opportunities for gov work, but it seems like if I were to go career I would never make it above Col (not that there's ANYTHING wrong with that). True? Not true?
2) Swimming. I swim like a damn rock, even after working on it for a few months last summer. How much swimming is actually involved? From what I've read it seems pretty important.

Thanks a bunch guys, this stuff keeps going back and forth in my head and it'll be nice to hear first hand from you guys what's up!

[NightLandNav]

2) Swimming. … From what I've read it seems pretty important.


Replace “seems pretty important” with “is a critical skill” ...as in crucial to outcome.

Even if you swam like Ian Thorpe, it appears you have a good deal to realistically consider.

Keep reading, self assess.

[CombatWombat]

1) What kind of career options do SF officers have after they leave the Army? From what I've read there are a lot of opportunities for gov work, but it seems like if I were to go career I would never make it above Col (not that there's ANYTHING wrong with that). True? Not true?

Current average exit rank in the Army is Major. A successful career is considered LTC at retirement. Pick up rate for COL is well under 20% of a particular year group, generally. If you make O-6 you won't care about what you do after the Army since you'll have served between 25-30 years and have a retirement paycheck larger than most guys are getting for showing up for work. Only the very best make COL, much less beyond that.

Becoming a SF officer is much harder than becoming an SF enlisted man and involves a significant amount of chance. You must serve in a basic branch (Infantry, Armor, Quartermaster, etc.) until you are a Captain. You then have a brief window before you go to the career course when you can apply to the board for a shot to go to SFAS. If you get picked, and that's a big if, then you still need to get picked up at SFAS. Your window is also fixed, regardless of your deployment status. So, if you're downrange when your packet is due and you can't get everything in to the SF recruiters, no SFAS for you.

The bottom line is, while we may have a great need for SF qualified enlisted men, there is much less need for officers (there are some great jokes just waiting in that last sentence). If you want to be in SF more than anything, including being a commissioned officer, go 18X and get in the pipeline now. If you want to be an officer more than be in SF, get your commission, do your damndest to get to SFAS, but be prepared for a life outside of SF.

If you are already thinking about life after the Army before you've even gone in, perhaps the level of commitment required to lead an ODA is more than you can handle. Nothing wrong with that, but there is something wrong with coming in to just punch a ticket and get a merit badge. As far as preparation for lucrative careers after the service, I would consider serving in the signal corps or logistics world before going combat arms. We may tout the great managerial and leadership skills developed by a career in the Infantry, but you'll still get a better paying job when you get out if you know how to manage a microwave communications station.

Good luck. These are weighty decisions and should not be made lightly. My advice, for what it's worth, is to determine what you want right now more than anything and go for that. The future has a way of sorting itself out. Set some goals, sure, but keep focused on the here and now rather than where you might be in 5 years.

[C-M-R]

My father was a Special Forces sniper in Vietnam, I was asked during AFROTC if I had considered applying for CSR, and y Army recruiter kept asking me about Special Forces. I guess I have two big concerns that have held me back from really being confident in thinking SF:


ASByron is that your name? STOP thinking about yourself...PLEASE! I am trying my very best not to unload on you but your post exhibits the worst traits of young officers and exemplifies why Lieutenants are not allowed to be team XO's.

Special Forces is not about you or your career progression. LtCol is a goal for some as is one, two or even three stars. Special Forces is not about rank nor is it about life after retirement because one is never EX SF, never.

Special Forces is a creed and a standard. It has nothing to do with careers and earning ability afterwards except to those who just don't get it. 'kay?

[ASByron]

I am trying my very best not to unload on you but your post exhibits the worst traits of young officers and exemplifies why Lieutenants are not allowed to be team XO's.

If you want to unload on me, please do! I appreciate the criticism as the more I get, the better officer I will be when I finally get in. I'd rather get hacked up before hand than be a no-clue butter bar, regardless of what I'm doing in the Army. I definitly have put a lot of thought into plans post-Army, especially after seeing my dad (100% disabled from the Army) screw up his and my mom's lives so bad after his SF service (drugs/booz & PTSD arne't fun as I'm sure you understand). Sooo I'm trying to avoid that, only reason I really want to think it through.

Thanks for the posts guys I appreciate it and I'm looking forward to hearing more from you.

[Ranger5280]

ASBryon...you're really the only one that can answer the question of fresh start or family tradition. Concerning the post-mil that you saw in your own family...you either get caught up in the past and relive it or make your own way. That's up to you.

Swimming is critical but don't let it stop you. You can overcome that. I was a terrible swimmer when I first enlisted but went on to graduate CDQC.

[ASByron]

Good to know I've got plenty of time to improve the swimming. Definitly a plus that there is no required form (correct me if I'm wrong, only requirements are no swimming on your back and no touching sides/bottom of pool). Should be interesting with BDU's on, I knew holding onto them would be a good idea!

Thanks again for the posts.

[B 2/75]

ASByron asked the following:

1) What kind of career options do SF officers have after they leave the Army? From what I've read there are a lot of opportunities for gov work, but it seems like if I were to go career I would never make it above Col (not that there's ANYTHING wrong with that). True? Not true?

If you become an officer, you should not at this point plan on a career. Plan instead on staying four or five years, and making Captain. Anything after that, be it additional years of service or rank, will be pure, rich gravy. You could very easily find yourself hating the army after only a few years, so eliminating a branch from consideration because "I would never make it above COL" reflects poorly upon your decision-making skills. Oh, don't forget that we have a couple of wars going on, too. Participation in them has a tendency of changing people's perspective.

2) Swimming. I swim like a damn rock, even after working on it for a few months last summer. How much swimming is actually involved? From what I've read it seems pretty important.

If you can't swim yet, then you aren't trying hard enough and are not demonstrating an acceptable level of determination. If you want something, you'll swim... even with web gear, rifle, uniform and boots on.