Reserve Sheriff Program

[FLTCREW1]

Ok, what's the inside scoop on this.
I am considering an application and want to know the "real deal".

I've always wanted to be in LE (preferable a Dog Handler, but..) this seems like a good place to start.

[Erick]

I can't speak for other agencies, but we try to hire folks who've proven themselves - i.e: correctional officers, reserves, laterals. I was lucky enough to have been hired, in part, out of our Helo/SAR unit.

Erick

[bd]

Hi Fltcrew1,

Many departments, especially smaller ones have a reserve officer program. You will first need to check with the dept in question to make sure they do indeed have a reserve program. You will have to attend a police academy and get either a reserve or full commission. The entry standards are all up to the individual depts and some will even pay for your academy.

A word about academies and commissions: many state certification agencies offer reserve officer commissions with a basic reserve academy which will be a mimimum number of hours (usually 100+ classroom). Next there is intermediate reserve and then you can get your full commission (I'm using Texas as an example here...things vary from state to state). A reserve commission generally won't allow you to work as a full-time officer.

Reserve duties depend on the dept, but most don't allow their reserve officers to specialize (SWAT/K-9/Investigations/etc) and instead use reserves for patrol. Weather you get paid or not is also up to the individual dept. Some smaller depts will pay their reserves, however, in some depts reserves are strictly a volunteer force. How much time you work depends on the dept, but ranges from 1 to 4 shifts per month in general.

What you do with your reserve commission all depends on you. If you want to be full-time in LE, your best bet is to attend a full academy. However, the reserve route is a good way to "get your feet wet" and lead into a full-time position.

Hope this helps. Take care and be safe.

BD

[FLTCREW1]

BD,
Yes it did help but as you can imagine it warranted more questions, LOL.

As I understand the situation, The local Sheriff Dept is taking applications for X number of reserve deputies. (they put an ad in the paper) It is with no pay, 1 to 4 shifts a month which must be on weekends. First is the interview process, then the training, which is every thursday evening for 2 months. You are then paired with a Deputy that is "full time" i.e. paid.
The Deputy that I spoke with said that after training I would be doing the exact same job as the paid guys, to include patrol work, only with no pay of course. He also said that the reserves serve 90% of the warrants freeing up the "regulars" to do traffic and other such things.
Now my question is this, am I going to be actually doing the same things as other LE officers or am I going to be used for all the shit work and they just say that to get guys into the program.
Also to get into the program I'm required to provide my own weapon and 300 rounds of ammo for training (which doesn't sound like a whole lot, considering most guys shoot in excess of 2000 rds in 1 week during assessment for the unit I'm in)

It sounds like a good way to get my feet wet, so to speak, and still keep my day job. It will let me know If I actually want to pursue a career in LE. But it would be pointless to go through the program if I don't get to see the real side of LE.
See what I'm getting at?

NSDQ

[RECON5]

FLTCREW1 -

Using BD example location as reference, I can tell you yes there are times when you will get stuck with some shit work. It should not be a constant problem because dept that use reserves use them to make a lack of man power. Hence, if they are lacking in man power they will be using there reserves to help knock out the work load. Warrant Service is not considered shit work, if that is what it really is, just make sure its not serving civil papers, that is shit work.
Regardless, the experience will give the exposure to all aspects of the LE job to evalute, while making your decision to go full time.
Another reality. Most, not all, LE agencies smaller than your major cities will not shoot 2k rounds per year, much less per week. Example, while serving on a Tac Team in a medium size dept, we averaged shooting 2000 rounds per month, but patrol only shot 500 per year. Now, in CID with the State it is about 500 per year.(not counting the training I provide at my own cost, on my own time) That is just LE for you. You will spend more time completing "academic" training. LE will require a vast knowledge of the everchanging laws (city ord, county ord, state law, fed law). It is not hard to stay sharp on your skills, but it usually comes on personal time, at personal expense especially in a reserve status. Unlike the military, your practical use of the enforcement of criminal laws will be used and tested constantly. The firearm very rarely (depending on the area you work).
Hope this helps.

REMEMBER 1*

[FLTCREW1]

Well,
I guess I'll just have to give it a try and see how it goes. I dropped off my App. today and the interview next month.
I've already had some classes towards my Bach. in Criminal Justice (the best one I think was Constitutional Law) I really enjoyed it. I just wanted to make sure that there was nothing that I was missing (sounds just a little too good, ya know).
As far as not using my weapon that often, believe me that doesn't break my heart in the slightest. I've been shot and had to shoot others, it's not what the movies make it out to be, LOL.

Last question, does the training that I stated in my previous post sound adequate?

Thanks for the help and patience.

NDSQ

[Sharky]

Well here's my two cents. The above posts are on the money but I would offer some advice. #1 As long as you are a reserve keep a low-profile. Mouth shut but eyes and ears wide open. You will get along much better with the full-time officers. I learned that one the hard way. #2 Listen to the "old-timers". If they think you are really interested in what they have to say they can give you some VERY good advice about the job. I learned more about the job from the old guys than I ever did at the academy. #3 Hang out in the jail alot, if you can, and just WATCH how they act and LISTEN to what they are saying. The jail is like an encyclopedia of the criminal mind. Learn early how to play mind games with their heads and how to be fair but firm. They have a totally different thought process than you or I. It's like child psychology. I learned more about dealing with criminals working in the jail than I did on the street. #4 Start practicing mental alertness now. Try to be aware of everything going on around you.#5 Get in the habit of taking good notes. Even if it doesn't seem important at the time, WRITE IT DOWN! If you pursue a career in LE I guarantee you this will save your ass several times during your career. #6 As soon as you are in look into getting Professional Liability Insurance. ESPECIALLY if you are a reserve. This too will save your ass someday down the road, I guarantee it. Some of the senior officers should be able to point you in the right direction on this. Well, that's just my two cents. One more thing, get that degree in ANYTHING BUT criminal justice and get on with a FED agency. The same amount of bullshit but the paycheck is generally a lot better. I dont know why but most FED agencies don't seem to want people with Criminal Justice degrees for some reason. A degree in accounting seems to open a lot of doors though. Who knows? Good luck. I hope this helps you out.

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F.I.D.O.

[FLTCREW1]

Thanks for all the help, I'll post again in a month or so, let you know how it goes.

NSDQ

[RECON5]

Fltcrew -

Sharky makes an excellent point about the Criminal Justice Degree. If you ever decide this is not your bag that degree is completely worthless. If you get another degree it will be better excepted by everyone including LE.

Sharky -

I was told by a Sr. Fed Agent the reason they like the Accounting is it will demonstrate the anyalitical mindset that the FBI type investigations usually require. The other degree they prefer is Law (Law School). Here is the kicker. If you are an accounting major and put in for the FBI you only test against other accountants, if your a law major you only test against other law majors, if you have a criminal justice major your scores, and creditials are tested against everyone. Atleast this is the way I understood it. FYI

Good Luck Fltcrew.

REMEMBER 1*

[Sharky]

Recon, that makes sense. Those guys investigate such things as embezzlement and fraud also so I can see where the degree would be handy in accounting for that reason also. My impression about the CJ degree is that they will teach you everything you need to know about the law in the academy and they would rather you have an open mind as a trainee than to think you already know what they are trying to teach. Who knows.

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F.I.D.O.

[RECON5]

Sharky -

That is pretty much it. It doesnt matter what you learn in college the agency you hire on with teach you "there way" of doing things. It changed drastically for me moving from municiple to state agency. They kinda look at a college degree as an indication of your level of commitment.

REMEMBER 1*

[FLTCREW1]

Thanks for all the input gentleman.

I may not have worded one of my questions correctly, when I was asking if the training sounded adequate I was referring to the classroom portion, (every thursday for 2 months).
Another question I thought of, since being sued has been mentioned: Being an active duty SOF, will that bite me in the ass if I get sued? meaning will/can that be used to my detriment.

NSDQ

[This message has been edited by FLTCREW1 (edited 07-04-2000).]

[bd]

Hi FLTCREW1,

Your basic academy training will have to fulfill the basic minimum requirements that your state has in place for a reserve commission. It will include the *basics* of federal/state/local laws and some field techniques. What will probably not be gone into in great depth is extensive field training exercises (i.e. shooting skills, arrest mechanics). That will most likely be for your advanced training nd field training once you have the basic reserve commission. So, yea, it will be adequate.

As for the lawsuit question. That all depends on specific incidents...you know how lawyers can be. But I wouldn;t worry about the SOF angle. Your department will do everything possible to ensure you are properly trained and employed. (As long as you don't freak out and play GOPLAT takedown on someone undeserving, you should be ok. ;-) ) There are *lots* of former SOF guys in LE.
Hope this helps. Good luck in the academy by the way! Take care and be safe.

BD

[RECON5]

Fltcrew -

Let me tell you a little story......
Four team mates were involved in an incident that went to trial. The defense attorney played the "They train together, work together, fight together, and ......Lie together" angle. Now granted we were in designated uniforms, which openly displayed our assigned positions. If you keep the SOF thing "in house" and dont go ranting about it to every individual you arrest BD is right you ought to be okay. Just be aware that if it comes to a use of force issue defense attorney's will use anything they can to discredit you on the stand. I think the same will apply civilly, but the criminal court issue is much more likely to occur sooner.
Keep it clean, and work with the same integrity you did with SOF and you should be ok.

REMEMBER 1*

[WS-G]

One small addendum to bd's exposition of how the commissioning process works here in Texas: one recent change is that graduation from the Basic Academy and a passing score on the TCLEOSE Basic Peace Officer Exam now result only in eligibility for a license, not the license itself. To be "licensed" now, one must have actually been hired by a department. If you're not hired within two years of graduation then, no matter how many more advanced courses you may have gone back for, then it's back to square one and a repeat of the entire basic academy has to be done all over again.

I passed the "full" academy course at Angelina College Police Academy, Class #99-08 in Lufkin, TX — a 640-hour course that was in excess of the TCLEOSE-mandated 540 training hours (the "reserve" academy they offer is broken into 3 part-time stages, but has the same total hours, covers the same topics and has the same standards in order to pass) — and passed the Basic Peace Officer exam this past December, and have done 48 hours' worth of follow-on courses since then. I'll be going back day after tomorrow for Intermediate Arrest, Search and Seizure, and am doing the Mental Health Officer Certification Course week after next. Once I get Intermediate Crime Scene Search and Intermediate Child Abuse Investigation out of the way, all I'll need for an Intermediate Peace Officer License is two years on the job!

As for an SOF background, having one myself, I can say first-hand that it can stand you in good stead, but is not a guarantee of acceptance. It's been nearly seven months since getting certified, and I'm still trying to get hired!

Obtaining that first LE job, whether full-time or reserve, is said to be the biggest hurdle. I enrolled in the academy at my own expense, without even the remotest semblance of sponsorship, just to become eligible to apply with some of the departments in the area where I currently reside. This was after having previously placed highly in the initial selection process for both the US Border Patrol and the Oregon State Police and still not getting hired.

With the USBP, I was chopped at the outset due to the eyesight requirements (I'm correctable with glasses to 20/12 bilaterally, but my uncorrected visual acuity is way below their limits; no waivers allowed). As for the OSP, I'd gotten all the way to their Secondary Interview (most of their candidates don't make it that far), only to be notified a few weeks later "...you may re-apply at any time". And this was with scores of 94.5% on the Border Patrol Agent Exam and 98% on the OSP Entry Level Test!

For educated, motivated "hard-chargers", it's often the small, quibbling, seemingly insignificant minutiae that get you eliminated. Also, keep in mind that small, rural departments tend to give preference to individuals who "belong to" the local area. This may seem socio-politically motivated, and even smack of nepotism in some cases (occasionally, this assessment will prove true), but as a practical matter, someone who's lived in the local community most of his life will (1) be cheaper, faster and easier to check out during the Background Investigation (i.e.: verifying his PHS is a mere formality), and (2) is often assumed to know the local area/populace better.

I'll echo the remarks made about hanging around the jail. Some of my former Basic Academy instructors, as well a classmate from Intermediate Use of Force, maintain that it's the best way there is of (1) learning the criminal mind first-hand, (2) getting to know your "usual suspects", (3) learning the beat (from all of the prisoner transports you'll be doing), and (4) learning courtroom procedure inside-out (from the time you'll spend as a bailiff). All suggested this to me as well, maintaining I'd be a better officer in the long run for it. Since my long-term LE career goal is fly for an Air Support Unit, I figure this is as good a way as any to pay for that vitally important helicopter rating!


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ex Co. G (-)(Abn/Rgr), 143d INF(LRRP), TXARNG 1981-1985
ex 433MAW (AFRES), 1985-1991
FAA-certificated pilot and Advanced Ground Instructor


[This message has been edited by William M Salter (edited 07-08-2000).]

[Sharky]

Mr. Salter, Not sure if you are interested but El Paso P.D. is begging for officers right now. They are severely shorthanded. I don't know how your certifications work here because El Paso P.D. has their own academy here. I'm not sure if you would have to do their academy or not. Might not hurt to give them a call though if you are willing to move. Sorry to hear about your ordeal with the patrol. Hang tough and keep trying and if there is anything I can do to help let me know. I have some friends at P.D.

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F.I.D.O.

[WS-G]

Sharky:

Thanks for the tip — and the encouragement. I looked into the El Paso PD already, and unfortunately I'd be facing the same obstacle with them that kept me out of the Border Patrol: eyeballs.

El Paso PD requires no worse than 20/100 uncorrected. Without correction, even under the the best possible conditions, I test no better than 20/200 distant, and 20/70 near. On less-than-spectacular days, I've tested as low as 20/400 uncorrected — just depends on time-of-day, my sleep-deprivation status, and the exam used. On the up side, I can score perfectly on every standard color perception test known, and have a corrected visual acuity of 20/12 with glasses (less than 5% of the population is able to see that well). BTW, I'm not considered a suitable candidate for refractive surgery.

Other than uncorrected vision, the physical stuff is not a problem: I'm currently 36-yo (often mistaken for 25), 6'1½", 168# (6% body fat), have an FAA Class I medical, run five days per week (typically a 10-miler one day, another day either 30 minutes' worth of sprints or Yasso-800's, and a 5-mile "Ranger Run" the other three days), multiple sets pushups/situps/pullups (my chinning bar gets 70-100 total reps — albeit in sets! — three days per week).

All a matter of persistence, I suppose. I have yet to speak to even one LEO who got hired by the first agency he ever applied to.

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ex Co. G (-)(Abn/Rgr), 143d INF(LRRP), TXARNG 1981-1985
ex 433MAW (AFRES), 1985-1991
FAA-certificated pilot and Advanced Ground Instructor

[Sharky]

Hang tough bro, good luck.

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F.I.D.O.