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View Full Version : AK-47 feeding problems.


HMdepperNavy
11 June 2008, 23:54
Alright, just took out my brand new AK today for the first time. Me and my buddy only had 60 rounds, so we would load 5 every turn. Constantly, throughout the entire time we were shooting the rounds kept feeding improperly; sometimes it was double feeding. We spent just as much time picking rounds up off the ground as we did shooting. Now, my guess is it could be a magazine problem. The gun shop gave me a dirty ass mag, and it wobbles when in the gun. The wind was even moving the mag. Is that whats causing the feeding problem?

Also, are there some AK's where the bolt locks back? If I pull the bolt back slowly it locks, and then unlocks when I pull back and finish the action.

yojinbukai
12 June 2008, 00:58
Semi-auto AK's will often have the bolt hang up a little on the top of the hammer when it is in the cocked position. It's just friction, not an actual bolt lock or hold-open feature. You can modify your weapon to lock open on the last round, however.

My 1st guess, based on your description, is that the magazine was not seated properly.

Camel
12 June 2008, 02:23
Double feeding is a symptom of failure to extract or eject. Maybe a feeding issue due to the mag. The mag wobbling is not a good thing. You should get some new ones of your own. As a general rule its a good idea to leave a misfired round alone, don't pick them up off the ground until your policing up brass. I don't have enough experience with the AK to give much advice on the internals. Iraqgunz does. I'd wait to hear what he has to say.

BTW what kind of AK is it, Who makes it?

HMdepperNavy
12 June 2008, 03:05
Double feeding is a symptom of failure to extract or eject. Maybe a feeding issue due to the mag. The mag wobbling is not a good thing. You should get some new ones of your own. As a general rule its a good idea to leave a misfired round alone, don't pick them up off the ground until your policing up brass. I don't have enough experience with the AK to give much advice on the internals. Iraqgunz does. I'd wait to hear what he has to say.

BTW what kind of AK is it, Who makes it?

Yeah, the wobbling didn't seem right to me. I'm going to go back to the shop and try to get a new mag.

It's a Romanian Lancaster, model MK99. Red wood, stainless bolt. So far I love it.

KSM
12 June 2008, 03:26
I'm going to go out on a limb here, so don't hate me for this, but are you inserting the mag correctly? You don't just slam an AK mag straight home like on an AR, you have to rock it in like an M-14, inserting the front first, then rocking it back into place. It just seems strange to me that the wind would make the mag wobble in the well, even if it was an old, shitty mag. But then again, I'm certainly no AK expert, so I could be mistaken (it's happened before!).

HMdepperNavy
12 June 2008, 03:41
I'm going to go out on a limb here, so don't hate me for this, but are you inserting the mag correctly? You don't just slam an AK mag straight home like on an AR, you have to rock it in like an M-14, inserting the front first, then rocking it back into place. It just seems strange to me that the wind would make the mag wobble in the well, even if it was an old, shitty mag. But then again, I'm certainly no AK expert, so I could be mistaken (it's happened before!).

No pun taken, but yes, I seat the mag properly. A few years back when I was getting into shooting I had the chance to fire a fully auto AK, and I was taught the function of the gun then. Btw, they called it the blood gun because it was supposily taken off a dead VC back in Vietnam lol.

iraqgunz
12 June 2008, 04:14
Not all Ak's are created equal. Romanian guns are OK, but SAR-1 and WASR models have had issues in the past. Most every model AK that I have seen will have a slight amount of front/rear play when mags are inserted in the mag well.

Also, guns that are built from parts kits here in the U.S have had issues as well. Though I have no info about your particular model. Even as of recent Arsenal which makes very good Ak's had issues with some guns that they sent out with an extreme front sight base cant that would not allow them to field zero.

If you are experiencing a true double feed (2 live rounds simultaneously being stripped from the mag) then the mag is the problem and not the gun. If you are experiencing a failure to extract along with a failure to feed then that is something entirely different. I have AK's that have been hammered and some of them are at least 30 years old and they keep on rocking.

As for bolt hold open. Yugo series guns IIRC will lock back after the last shot, but I beleive that their magazines also have a raised follower in them them. When these are used with standard AK's they tend to get beat up.

You should be able to find decent quality mags out and about for about 14.00. Try Shotgun News.

HMdepperNavy
12 June 2008, 04:38
Not all Ak's are created equal. Romanian guns are OK, but SAR-1 and WASR models have had issues in the past. Most every model AK that I have seen will have a slight amount of front/rear play when mags are inserted in the mag well.

Also, guns that are built from parts kits here in the U.S have had issues as well. Though I have no info about your particular model. Even as of recent Arsenal which makes very good Ak's had issues with some guns that they sent out with an extreme front sight base cant that would not allow them to field zero.

If you are experiencing a true double feed (2 live rounds simultaneously being stripped from the mag) then the mag is the problem and not the gun. If you are experiencing a failure to extract along with a failure to feed then that is something entirely different. I have AK's that have been hammered and some of them are at least 30 years old and they keep on rocking.

As for bolt hold open. Yugo series guns IIRC will lock back after the last shot, but I beleive that their magazines also have a raised follower in them them. When these are used with standard AK's they tend to get beat up.

You should be able to find decent quality mags out and about for about 14.00. Try Shotgun News.

Thanks a ton for the response. There were times where it was truely double feeding, but also times where only one round was feeding improperly. I am not expirienced enough to know whether it was an extract or feeding problem, but the round was completely out of the mag. As for the bolt holding, it doesn't lock with rapid and hard pulling, and while shooting; only does it if I pull back the handle slowly.

iraqgunz
12 June 2008, 09:15
The bolt and op rod assembly won't purposely lock back, but you can make it do that. Essentially a double feed is caused by crappy magazines (feed lips and or springs). A failure to extract is when the round is still stuck in the chamber area or partially pulled out. A failure to eject is when the round has been extracted and it is hung up inside the receiver (this is primarily on M16 type weapons). Now if you have an empty case in the chamber and a live round feeding into it, then you have a failure to extract/ eject which in the natural order then caused it to not feed. Failure to extract is most often associated with a weak/ damaged extractor, dicked up chamber or a combination thereof.

I have seen AK's fire with some crappy ass ammo and still work. But, once again we are talking about a parts type gun built in the U.S by an AK Guru. I am willing to bet if you get new mags, the double feeds will stop. I would also look into replacement springs. Wolff may sell them, not sure.

BTW- We may be neighbors soon as I am trying to get a house in Goodyear. My wife is there now with the agent trying to work some deals.

Thanks a ton for the response. There were times where it was truely double feeding, but also times where only one round was feeding improperly. I am not expirienced enough to know whether it was an extract or feeding problem, but the round was completely out of the mag. As for the bolt holding, it doesn't lock with rapid and hard pulling, and while shooting; only does it if I pull back the handle slowly.

HMdepperNavy
12 June 2008, 09:23
The bolt and op rod assembly won't purposely lock back, but you can make it do that. Essentially a double feed is caused by crappy magazines (feed lips and or springs). A failure to extract is when the round is still stuck in the chamber area or partially pulled out. A failure to eject is when the round has been extracted and it is hung up inside the receiver (this is primarily on M16 type weapons). Now if you have an empty case in the chamber and a live round feeding into it, then you have a failure to extract/ eject which in the natural order then caused it to not feed. Failure to extract is most often associated with a weak/ damaged extractor, dicked up chamber or a combination thereof.

I have seen AK's fire with some crappy ass ammo and still work. But, once again we are talking about a parts type gun built in the U.S by an AK Guru. I am willing to bet if you get new mags, the double feeds will stop. I would also look into replacement springs. Wolff may sell them, not sure.

Oh okay, then the answer is no to failure to extract. The gun was firing fine, it was just being able to even fire that was the problem lol. I was doing some research, and I guess the Romanians have a problem with their mag wells being too big, but that most don't have feeding problems despite the wobbling. If thats the case, then I'll try poly mags which I heard have a tighter fit, or I'll just buy a new reciever. I still have a chrome lined barrel, stainless bolt, and awsome wood/finish; so I don't want to get rid of the rifle. I also found out my front sight post is canted. Is that easy to fix?

HMdepperNavy
12 June 2008, 09:27
BTW- We may be neighbors soon as I am trying to get a house in Goodyear. My wife is there now with the agent trying to work some deals.

Are you going to be working at Luke? I'm not sure if my dad goes up to Goodyear, but if he does; I could probably get you a discount on an appraisal if you need one. However I know some mortgage companies send out their own, but if not, let me know.

iraqgunz
12 June 2008, 17:46
No, just escaping the Peoples Republik of Kalifornia while we can. I work overseas and visit home when I can. :D


Are you going to be working at Luke? I'm not sure if my dad goes up to Goodyear, but if he does; I could probably get you a discount on an appraisal if you need one. However I know some mortgage companies send out their own, but if not, let me know.

iraqgunz
12 June 2008, 17:53
Oh okay, then the answer is no to failure to extract. The gun was firing fine, it was just being able to even fire that was the problem lol. I was doing some research, and I guess the Romanians have a problem with their mag wells being too big, but that most don't have feeding problems despite the wobbling. If thats the case, then I'll try poly mags which I heard have a tighter fit, or I'll just buy a new reciever. I still have a chrome lined barrel, stainless bolt, and awsome wood/finish; so I don't want to get rid of the rifle. I also found out my front sight post is canted. Is that easy to fix?

I have a shitload of Romanian guns here (these are military export though) and they seem to do pretty good. I am wondering about the maker of the gun and if they even checked it out. If the front sight base is crooked I would send it back. The front sight base is pinned in place. My guess is they may have had blank barrels and then milled the slots in them and installed the FSB. It's really hard to say. There are two ways to rebarrel the weapon. Remove the barrel pin, use a hydraulic press to press the barrel out, or lock the receiver in a vise, get a large brass punch and brass hammer and beat it out. If you warm it up and apply lube it will come off rather quickly. It's a pain in the ass though.

HMdepperNavy
12 June 2008, 23:32
I have a shitload of Romanian guns here (these are military export though) and they seem to do pretty good. I am wondering about the maker of the gun and if they even checked it out. If the front sight base is crooked I would send it back. The front sight base is pinned in place. My guess is they may have had blank barrels and then milled the slots in them and installed the FSB. It's really hard to say. There are two ways to rebarrel the weapon. Remove the barrel pin, use a hydraulic press to press the barrel out, or lock the receiver in a vise, get a large brass punch and brass hammer and beat it out. If you warm it up and apply lube it will come off rather quickly. It's a pain in the ass though.

Its only slightly crooked, and still shoots straight. The guys at the shop today said that its not uncommon, and that if it still shoots fine to just leave it as is. But lets say I wanted to fix it; would I save more money getting a new barrel? Or would it be cheaper to get a gunsmith to straighten it?

The91Bravo
13 June 2008, 00:21
Have you disassembled the mags and cleaned all the cosmoline (red grease) out?

I would carry the rifle with you when you go get magazines for it, that way you get one that locks in properly for that individual weapon.

My WASR 10 Romanian came with two mags. One fits perfectly, and one perfectly gives me fits.. ha ha

Overall I am 99.9% satisfied with mine.

Good luck....

HMdepperNavy
13 June 2008, 00:25
Have you disassembled the mags and cleaned all the cosmoline (red grease) out?

I would carry the rifle with you when you go get magazines for it, that way you get one that locks in properly for that individual weapon.

My WASR 10 Romanian came with two mags. One fits perfectly, and one perfectly gives me fits.. ha ha

Overall I am 99.9% satisfied with mine.

Good luck....

Oh, I only cleaned the outside, but it was still wayy to wobbly; grease or no grease. Anyways, I actually got the mag replaced today, and I brought my rifle with me to make sure it fit. It appears I had a Bulgarian mag, and I heard that the Romanians sometimes have trouble with those mags. With your WASR 10, did the bad mag cause constant mis-feeding?

The91Bravo
13 June 2008, 01:47
The bad mag was loose, but the only real problem was inserting the mag in the weapon. It took more conscious effort to place it correctly. No feeding problems at all. I would still disassemble and clean the guts of the magazine. You will be amazed how much shit is in there.

HMdepperNavy
13 June 2008, 02:54
The bad mag was loose, but the only real problem was inserting the mag in the weapon. It took more conscious effort to place it correctly. No feeding problems at all. I would still disassemble and clean the guts of the magazine. You will be amazed how much shit is in there.

What is good to use to clean that stuff out? I heard brake cleaner worked good.

iraqgunz
13 June 2008, 04:14
Simple Green mixed with real hot water will dissolve the stuff pretty good. Then just wipe the residue off with rags. The guys at the gun shop are saying "just leave it" because they don't want to deal with it. Rest assured if it was their rifle it would have been in the mail already. When Arsenal screwed up some of their guns recently they fixed the problem as they should. If you don't think it is right send it back.

I generally do not go to gun stores for any advice about anything because there are plenty of them out there that don't know shit. My guess would be putting a good straight barrel and FSB would be cheaper than removing the FSB, finding the exact issue, fixing it and all the other things that would have to bo done.

Or you can sell it, take a small loss and then order an Arsenal AK-103 or similar gun. They are very well made and I look forward to getting one as soon as I am out of the PRK.

The91Bravo
13 June 2008, 11:30
What is good to use to clean that stuff out? I heard brake cleaner worked good.

Simple green works well, but as a result of the microwave generation... I want it done NOW :D I use generic spray brake cleaner, outside on a warm day. Every time I get started spraying, I tell myself I should have put my eye protection.... just as I get some spatter of brake cleaner in my eye.... burns worse than my dept issue pepper spray.... so, wear some goggles, you will not regret it..

spray it, use a gun cleaning brush while it is damp, spray another small dose, let dry, wipe off residue... on a rag put some good quality gun oil (since you do not disassemble the mags all to frequently) then pull the rag through the interior of the mag, and then wipe the gun oil on the spring. wipe the base and follower really well, and then put it back together...

remember the goggles.... you will thank me :D

HOLLiS
13 June 2008, 13:12
Some magazine wobble is normal on a AK, it is just the way the mag well is made. Sounds more like magazine issues, besure the mag fits all the way up against the rails inside the receiver. If you have a good mag, compare deminsions, the lips, the mag catch. Also there are AK 47 mags and AK 74 mags, they are not interchangeable, but look very much alike. Also not all Mags are GTG.


Mags need love and care too, though many people tend to ignore them,


Generally AKs are very easy to work on and fix.