C'mon, the CF Can't Have Gone This Far Downhill

[King]

O.K., here's my deal. I'm an air cadet (would have gone army but there is no corps in my town). I have been an air cadet for 5 years and as a senior instructor I have to say that our organization is sounding tougher then the real military.

I've done the harrassment training they give us and I have seen our own standards go downhill but really, even we can still yell.

I'm very surprised at the level of PT that's generally accepted now. I have been exercising every day in part to prepare for the military but it sounds like I don't need to bother. The training standards and combat readiness sound terrible. How the hell has our military survived so long. A lot of the discussion has revolved around the reserves, but what about the reg. force? Any difference?

So what I guess I'm trying to say is that you have to be kidding? I mean there has to be some exageration here.

[Skip]

Many regular units around the world are at a very poor standrad of physical trainning or even in some cases combat trainning.

However, if you can tolerate it, and rise above it - go for JTF2 - I can assure you that the standards there are second to none.


Skip

[This message has been edited by Skip (edited 09-13-2000).]

[FNG]

What has been described is not really exaggeration; however, that is the official garrison or course 'standard' that in my opinion is designed just to test a soldier to see if they are really still living and breathing.

When you get into the field, you get your real 'PT test'. Even though PT standards drop, the job of the infanteer doesn't change. So it doesn't matter if your 5k time is 18 minutes or 25 minutes, you still have to march X kilometers with X pounds of equipment in any weather conditions, and be expected to do your job, such as attacking an enemy trench network. Often times, the X km and X pounds I mentioned above isn't decided by you. You march until you meet you get to your objective, and you carry whatever equipment is needed to do the job (And that has never gotten lighter in the history of warfare). A soldier cannot stop in the middle of a march or an attack because the distance exceeds the CF PT standard.

You have said that you are exercising everyday in preparation... good. Keep at it. By improving your physical ability beyond what the 'standard', you can only make things easier. Remember, a motivated soldier will never just meet the standard. It is the soldier's own responsibility to train themselves physically to endure the rigours of combat. To train themselves far beyond the standard, because there will be times when this is needed.

[Tm]

I do beleive the CF is that bad. However, it's not at soldier level. I've never met a troop yet who hasn't complained about it himself. Troubles lie further up at the political-military connection here and in the US. Like it or not, we exist in their shadow and we're getting a lot of the President Hillary Clinton fallout. During the Reagan years, they still called it Battleschool and it was tough. Basic was tough. Now it's all politics. Disbanding the Airborne was not a military decision. Now commanders are Career Managers first. These are the woes of a peacetime military in a soft society who can't envison any foreseeable threat, consequently see no place for the warrior. But the picture of a woman in fighting order and rifle on peacekeeping duty sure sells advertising time.

[VENOM]

I'm leaving for Basic training on the 25th of this month then Infantryman course in Valcartier after basic training. I have been training my ass off 6 days a week for 6 months now. I just hope that I don't loose what I have gain... Because I have heard that the basic training PT now is so low that people that are in excellent shape lose their edge because they have "to follow the rest of the pack". I just hope that is not true. Any inputs or comments from your experiences ?

Thanks and take care!

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VENOM

[TonyM]

Stay hard, push yourself you'll come out same/better than when you went in. With all the weenies coming in now, you'll make JTF in no time. Makes the good look even better now. Remember, basic is about mind games mostly, so keep a sense of humour and play the game.

[recce_o]

...and play the "grey man". Do nothing to draw attention to yourself. Lay low. Help out as best you can. But don't claim to know anything of any military utility. And DON'T talk about special operations. Specops is an irritant to conventional soldiers who are generally unable to think outside the box.

[garett]

I'm consistently irritated by people who tell me they are going to join the army to be a sniper, special operator, or a f*cking S.E.A.L.. Instead of "going off on then" I tend to just smile and nod. The people these days who tend to join the reserves think that they're going to be a commando by the time they finish their training. It seems to be a shock to everyone when they realise that it aint that hard and the majority of your time is spent on your ass falling asleep in class. On the last QL2 run at my unit I saw a few candidates quit or not continue on to their QL3 course because they realise that it is not very challenging if you prepare at all for the training. I was in a Demo Platoon this summer for the LFAA reserve ISCC and I realised that the only place I'm going to get any realistic useful training is if I go on Officer phase training. Currently my plan is to go RESO then go Reg when I'm finished my university degree. Lately I've become friends with someone who just finished their RCR Battle School and has been with 2 RCR for a couple of weeks. Already he is complaining about the dress and deportment and the physical shape of the soldiers around him who have been with the Battalion for awhile. I guess soldiers are showing up with dust on their boots from the previous day and are having a hard time on 10km webgear/weapon marches to the ranges. This doesn't encourage me to pursue a career in the Infantry as an officer because I would have a very hard time dealing with these unmotivated individuals. Just because the Soviets aren't preparing for the invasion on Western Europe anymore (well I guess I'm assuming they aren't) doesn't mean that we can all kick back and have a Bud. Its obvious to anyone with an open mind and a bit of intelligence that we are still on the verge of widespread conflict in many places all over the world. Maybe not the high intensity nuclear war which was expected a few years ago but there are enough highly motivated religious and political nut cases to go around.

[King]

So where does the blame lie for poor conditions. Generals, junior officers, senior NCO's, politicians, Canadians in general?

[Cree Warrior]

WEAK LEADERSHIP!!! Leadership that doesnt have the balls to stand up for what is needed, leadership that doesnt have the courage to say " Well gee, if there was a war, maybe alot of our guys would die, or ops would be jeopardized because our troops are out of shape and have lost their combat effectiveness". Leadership that can't stand up to the stupid, stupid human rights concerns re: training soldiers.
WEAK! Its disgusting!

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