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-   -   Multiple Officers shot in Philadelphia (http://www.socnet.com/showthread.php?t=135043)

Fu King Lawyer 19 August 2019 16:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildman43 (Post 1058811205)

Question FKL, could this individual get money for the time spent in prison, from the state or Feds?

@wildman43,
Possibly. Governments enjoy something called "sovereign immunity" where they don't have to pay routine torts, but most waive it in appropriate cases under set conditions and will pay damages. Feds have something called the "Federal Tort Claims Act". Several states have either a similar claims procedure or the legislature passes and the governor signs "private bills" authorizing compensation.
Depending on the state, YMMV. v/r fkl

bobmueller 19 August 2019 16:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildman43 (Post 1058811205)
Question FKL, could this individual get money for the time spent in prison, from the state or Feds?

I'm not FKL, but I've been following innocence stuff for several years. Some states give money outright; others require a special act of the state legislature.

In the states that do give money, some give a flat amount, no matter how long you were stuck in there. Texas gives you 80k/year. California gives you $140/day of wrongful incarceration. DC actually includes an amount for time spent on parole/probation/SO status. Maryland only pays "actual damages." Overview at the Innocence Project.

Fu King Lawyer 19 August 2019 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobmueller (Post 1058811221)
I'm not FKL, but I've been following innocence stuff for several years. Some states give money outright; others require a special act of the state legislature.

In the states that do give money, some give a flat amount, no matter how long you were stuck in there. Texas gives you 80k/year. California gives you $140/day of wrongful incarceration. DC actually includes an amount for time spent on parole/probation/SO status. Maryland only pays "actual damages." Overview at the Innocence Project.

Well done, Brother. With a clear conscience I'll start planning another vacation to Asia knowing that SOCNET is in good hands. Bravo Zulu. v/r fkl

EchoFiveMike 19 August 2019 19:18

Holding "the taxpayers" accountable for individual mistakes and/or deliberate malfeasance is completely pointless, if not deliberately malevolent. "The Taxpayer" has absolutely no control over the individuals involved, in most cases by design. Bring criminal charges vs individuals, only.

The Innocence people here in Chitcago out of NW University have been caught, repeatedly, committing bribery, witness tampering and other fuckery. Everyone "advocating" for the guilty has an angle, the defense attorneys at least are honest and open about theirs, to their credit.

Yes, I know Chicago is basically the perfect example of every type and level of corruption and scheme to fleece the taxpayer. All that said, I don't see the utility of the DP as currently used. It should be to eliminate repeat offenders, for all level of felonious crimes, to include (especially) financial crimes, fraud etc. Getting rid of career criminals would reduce the crime level to a meaningless fraction of the current level.

And that would take away the power from a lot of people, which is why it won't happen. S/F....Ken M

Polypro 20 August 2019 06:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Massgrunt (Post 1058811141)
I'm against the death penalty. I have personally seen bad eyewitness identifications and have arrested somebody for a rape that I was never sure he actually committed. People lie, people are wrong, people are dumb.

F'n 100 - people are so f'n stupid, I'm amazed we're still around - it is truly mind boggling.

Believeraz 20 August 2019 07:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Massgrunt (Post 1058811141)
I'm against the death penalty. I have personally seen bad eyewitness identifications and have arrested somebody for a rape that I was never sure he actually committed. People lie, people are wrong, people are dumb.

Eyewitness identification is a stand-alone standard for probable cause, the legal threshold for an arrest. Based on the incredibly poor history of eyewitness ID, I refuse to use it for PC without additional corroborating evidence. I use an Innocence Project presentation on the topic as well as the Ronald Cotton story as instructional materials when I teach academy legal and continuing ed courses for cops.

I have a solemn responsibility to protect the rights of a defendant as well as to seek justice for my victim in a criminal investigation. Reliance on eyewitness ID as a stand-alone does not adequately meet either of those obligations in my opinion.

redhawk 20 August 2019 10:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by grog18b (Post 1058811071)
Your post is incorrect.

...which is to not ruin someone's life with first offense armed robbery or aggravated assault charge, and plead to a lesser non violent offense. None of them were "normal law abiding people".

I don't think we're talking about the same thing. Krasner is permitting some gun cases (6106, 6111, etc.) to go to ARD. The only violent gun cases I've heard going to ARD were accidental/negligent shootings and self-defense cases.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Macka (Post 1058811094)
How many people in Philly are wrapped up in the examples you used?

I'm guessing a lot, as I deal with similar cases quite frequently. And, I've talked to numerous cops who openly admit that they've found technical violations of carrying without a license that they've chosen not to charge (which is a good thing, but also the law needs to be changed).
Quote:

Originally Posted by Believeraz (Post 1058811325)
post

Thank you. The procedures have undoubtedly improved, but there's definitely some work to be done.

cj 20 August 2019 10:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by EchoFiveMike (Post 1058811248)
Everyone "advocating" for the guilty has an angle, the defense attorneys at least are honest and open about theirs, to their credit.

Not true, unless you view constitutional rights as an angle. Did you mean to lump the accused (pre-conviction) into that group?

mb5417 20 August 2019 12:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by redhawk (Post 1058811060)
Not sure why this would be a problem. Diversion allows the system to separate the insane and drug dealers from the people who just fucked up. Pennsylvania’s gun laws are incoherent and lots of normal, “law abiding” people get put through the ringer for simply not knowing the technical (bullshit) aspects of 6106. And, for the 18-20 year olds with no record who get caught with a Glock... well, a lot of them are protecting themselves from actually dangerous people. I’d rather not see those adult citizens labeled felons and stripped of their 2nd Amd. rights for simply wanting to exercise their 2nd Amd. right.

The problem is that they are not using it to separate out the drug dealers from the fuck ups. The shooter in this incident had multiple felonies including gun offenses that were diverted, plead down, or dropped completely.

I was doing some research on a new investigation the day this happened, and ran a target's criminal history. He had four prior arrests for gun offenses in Philly. Those charges were eventually dropped. I've seen violent offenders out on bail in NJ for illegal possession of firearms and attempted murder (in the same county where the girl from Philly was locked up for two months (IIRC) for bringing her legal CCW firearm across state lines to the casinos).

They want us to disarm to solve this gun "crisis" while they play lawyer games with the guys who are the actual problem. And as lawyers go, Krasner in Philly is frighteningly pro-criminal.

EchoFiveMike 20 August 2019 12:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by cj (Post 1058811358)
Not true, unless you view constitutional rights as an angle. Did you mean to lump the accused (pre-conviction) into that group?

I mean the convicted, especially habitual/career criminals. US society squanders a truly obscene amount of taxpayer resources on parasitic trash shaped like human beings. Sure, I understand an idealistic commitment to keeping the system honest, but that's not what any of this activism is. It's wrecking, in the Russian or Luddite sense of the term. It's an attack on the legitimacy of the system itself. To the point that in many places, it is an illegitimate system. Ie, most urban centers. All these police(and everyone else) are getting shot by multiple repeat felony offenders, "the system" keeps putting back into society. Clearly said system does not function as they supposedly claim it is intended to.

Better to fire everyone, and go back to an elected sheriff and raising a posse, and only punishment for severe crimes is hanging. All this Progressivism has created the opposite of "progress." S/F....Ken M

cj 20 August 2019 16:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by EchoFiveMike (Post 1058811377)
I mean the convicted, especially habitual/career criminals. US society squanders a truly obscene amount of taxpayer resources on parasitic trash shaped like human beings. Sure, I understand an idealistic commitment to keeping the system honest, but that's not what any of this activism is. It's wrecking, in the Russian or Luddite sense of the term. It's an attack on the legitimacy of the system itself. To the point that in many places, it is an illegitimate system. Ie, most urban centers. All these police(and everyone else) are getting shot by multiple repeat felony offenders, "the system" keeps putting back into society. Clearly said system does not function as they supposedly claim it is intended to.

Ok, I don't disagree with above.

just11b 20 August 2019 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fu King Lawyer (Post 1058811224)
Well done, Brother. With a clear conscience I'll start planning another vacation to Asia knowing that SOCNET is in good hands. Bravo Zulu. v/r fkl

:biggrin:

SN 20 August 2019 22:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildman43 (Post 1058811205)
Watching the news awhile back DNA testing provide someone who had been in jail for about 20 years innocent.

Question FKL, could this individual get money for the time spent in prison, from the state or Feds?

Texas has a program to pay restitution for those wrongly convicted.


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