SOCNET

Go Back   SOCNET: The Special Operations Community Network > General Topics > The Lounge

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #41  
Old 9 November 2018, 09:33
10thvet's Avatar
10thvet 10thvet is offline
Authorized Personnel
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Big Sky Country...
Posts: 3,291
Quote:
Originally Posted by gavin View Post
No one ever committed a mass shooting because they had PTSD or were a Marine.
I was watching a news report on the computer and it was either ABC/CBS but donít remember which one. Someone made this very point. They also brought up that he may have been mentally ill in high school because of several incidents. I doubt that segment will get much air time because it doesnít fit the narrative but a someone did say it.
__________________
"Since it is so likely that children will meet cruel enemies, let them at least have heard of brave knights and heroic courage" CS Lewis

America...a country founded by geniuses but managed by idiots
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 9 November 2018, 10:12
Streck-Fu's Avatar
Streck-Fu Streck-Fu is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 1,848
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10thvet View Post
I was watching a news report on the computer and it was either ABC/CBS but don’t remember which one. Someone made this very point. They also brought up that he may have been mentally ill in high school because of several incidents. I doubt that segment will get much air time because it doesn’t fit the narrative but a someone did say it.
That would mirror the Air Force kid who shot up the hospital in the mid- 90s. He was disturbed before ever enlisting and spent a good part of his active time hospitalized. LINK
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 9 November 2018, 10:20
Streck-Fu's Avatar
Streck-Fu Streck-Fu is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 1,848
Among those killed....RIP

Quote:
Daniel Manrique

Manrique, 33, was a Marine veteran.

'He had spent his entire adult life, post military service, helping veterans readjust to civilian life and had just recently accepted a position with Team RWB as the Pacific Regional Program Manager,' family member Gladys Manrique Koscak wrote in a tribute on Facebook.

'I have no doubt that he died a hero, shielding others from gunshots. He will forever be our hero, son, brother, and the best uncle anybody could ever ask for,' she said.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 9 November 2018, 10:28
gavin's Avatar
gavin gavin is offline
Unemployed Stunt Double
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: On a plane...
Posts: 6,996
Quote:
Originally Posted by leopardprey View Post
I am going to borrow this and edit the language, if you don't mind, post it on my local news site, where the headline is "Combat Marine commits mass shooting".
Absolutely!

Folks who need some help won't seek it because they don't want to be labeled as an unstable danger to the public.
__________________
Lifeís barely long enough to get good at one thing. So be careful what you get good at.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 9 November 2018, 13:39
Xdeth's Avatar
Xdeth Xdeth is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 4,731
Quote:
Originally Posted by Semp View Post
That asswipe was NOT a Marine. He stopped being a Marine when he decided to kill innocents.



RIP to the victims.

This is not directed at you but the way in which the MC wants to attempt this re-characterization when a Marine does something no one likes. Integrity is owning the bad too. He earned his title and served honorably AFAIK, this "once a Marine" title being revoked if we take the unofficial standard when someone does something awesome has to apply the other way. It seems like a PR stunt to disavow like this a sign that he was something other then a sick fuck who was a Marine, they do exist.
__________________
"First, decide who you would be. Then, do what you must do." -Epictetus
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 9 November 2018, 15:57
DirtyDog0311 DirtyDog0311 is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: South
Posts: 7,348
The whole "this guy was NOT a Marine" is just knee jerk emotional stuff. He was a Marine. So was Lee Harvey Oswald. And a whole bunch of other guys.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 9 November 2018, 16:17
anachranerd's Avatar
anachranerd anachranerd is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: In the wind
Posts: 156
Article here

So it appears this dude was a punk long before even the marines. Sexually assaulted his high school track coach.
__________________
"Seems like not having friends from all walks of society might mean missing out on a lot of what the world has to offer."

-SOTB
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 9 November 2018, 17:18
Xdeth's Avatar
Xdeth Xdeth is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 4,731
Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyDog0311 View Post
The whole "this guy was NOT a Marine" is just knee jerk emotional stuff. He was a Marine. So was Lee Harvey Oswald. And a whole bunch of other guys.
yea but it comes from the top leadership just short of, "to all who shall see these presents greetings, Know Ye that XXXX is no longer a Marine".

Our job is done, now let's go to lunch.
__________________
"First, decide who you would be. Then, do what you must do." -Epictetus
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 9 November 2018, 20:41
CAVmedic CAVmedic is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Mid West
Posts: 1,324
In my opinion, just like a member of Socnet, once you do enough wrong you can get banned just the same. It's the marines that like to say once a marine always a marine, but I'm not seeing why it's wrong to say title revoked, "On the Extract Bird".
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 9 November 2018, 21:15
Shadow's Avatar
Shadow Shadow is offline
Problem Solver
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Everywhere
Posts: 4,646
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVmedic View Post

...It's the marines that like to say once a marine always a marine...
FYI, when referencing the United States Marine Corps, "Marine" is a title and as such, it's always capitalized.
__________________
"If you force me to do violence, I shall be so savage and so cruel, and hurt you so badly that the thought of revenge shall never cross your mind" --Machiavelli

"Oderint, dum metuant" ("Let them hate, so long as they fear") - Caligula

"Those that know don't talk and those that talk don't know."
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 9 November 2018, 21:58
Massgrunt's Avatar
Massgrunt Massgrunt is online now
Policeman Officer
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Day shift.
Posts: 12,375
Quote:
Originally Posted by Streck-Fu View Post
That would mirror the Air Force kid who shot up the hospital in the mid- 90s. He was disturbed before ever enlisting and spent a good part of his active time hospitalized. LINK
I highly recommend the EXCELLENT book on this event written by Andy Brown, the SP who shot and killed the murderer with an M9 from something like 75 yards while being fired at with a rifle.
__________________
"The real problem was being able to stick it out, to sit in an office under the orders of a wee man in a dark gray suit and look out of the window and recall the bush country, the waving palms, the smell of sweat and cordite, the grunts of the men hauling jeeps over the river crossings, the copper-tasting fears just before the attack, and the wild, cruel joy of being alive afterward. To remember, and then go back to the ledgers and the commuter train, that was impossible. He knew he would eat his heart out if it ever came to that."

- "The Dogs of War" by Frederick Forsyth
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 9 November 2018, 22:28
Gumby2/6's Avatar
Gumby2/6 Gumby2/6 is offline
Calculating Infinity...
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NC
Posts: 1,548
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVmedic View Post
In my opinion, just like a member of Socnet, once you do enough wrong you can get banned just the same. It's the marines that like to say once a marine always a marine, but I'm not seeing why it's wrong to say title revoked, "On the Extract Bird".
Your opinion is just that... yours and not one that was shaped by service in the Corps. To compare being banned on Socnet to having your "title revoked", as a Marine, is asinine, to say the least.

Last edited by Gumby2/6; 9 November 2018 at 22:34.
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 10 November 2018, 00:07
CAVmedic CAVmedic is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Mid West
Posts: 1,324
^Sure.

I didn't give him that "title", and soldier doesn't get capitalized so I can see how assinine I look.

If you break a rule that causes you to loose your career in the military, nobody calls you by rank or title anymore. If you want to say he was a "Marine", and not a "former Marine", go ahead. Maybe there's a USMC regulation on it I don't know about.
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 10 November 2018, 01:14
DirtyDog0311 DirtyDog0311 is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: South
Posts: 7,348
There is no revocation. It simply is. The whole 'ex' vs 'former' Marine argument is equally as trivial, IMO.

Until they invent a time machine that can allow you to remove the experiences and training from an individual's history ---- the 'revocation' of the 'title' means absolutely nothing. It's empty hollow gestures, IMO. Maybe someone who is 'more Marine' than me can "overrule" me, but I feel that this whole thing about removing a title is just emotional blathering. It has no REAL substance behind it other than just virtue signaling. Not picking a fight with anyone. That's just my personal feeling on the matter.

With that in mind, I've never seen anything anywhere that officially declares "Marine" a title. As far as I know, it's just a recruiting and esprit de corps thing that's been there from way back. You "earn" it and it can't be taken away because it's a metaphor for a whole lot of things intangible and many specific to the USMC --- starting from the presentation of your EGA from your drill instructor(s) when you pass boot. The only official title I've ever received was "Pvt" or "Cpl" or more often --- "hey shithead" usually followed by the instruction to get a haircut or get my hands out of my pockets.

SOOOOoooo to keep this on target ---- yeah the shooter was a shitbag. And yes, he was a Marine. Moving on.......
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 10 November 2018, 04:24
Look. Don'tTouch. Look. Don'tTouch. is offline
killjoy
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: West
Posts: 1,742
Quote:
Originally Posted by DirtyDog0311 View Post
With that in mind, I've never seen anything anywhere that officially declares "Marine" a title.
Nothing official, but at MCRD, the title was always "recruit" before it turned into "Marine" at some point. Yes, recruit is spelled with a lower case r.

MOD EDIT: I'm going to leave this up, but if you're not a current or former Marine (or current or former military member) DO NOT lecture any of those that are on correct etiquette, mmmmmmmkay?
__________________
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.

Last edited by RGR.Montcalm; 11 November 2018 at 04:31.
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 10 November 2018, 10:08
Silverbullet's Avatar
Silverbullet Silverbullet is offline
Administrator
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Bunker
Posts: 15,145
Stay on topic.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 10 November 2018, 10:56
EchoFiveMike's Avatar
EchoFiveMike EchoFiveMike is offline
Make a desert and call it peace.
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: back home, IVO chicago
Posts: 8,336
The important thing, IMO, at this point is to determine where this guy went mental and what can be done to prevent future events of the sort. Was he FUBAR before joining? Was it a selection/recruiting issue? Did he get broke in service? Can we ID/treat/mitigate this in the future or was this a unicorn that needs to be addressed with "carry tools and be ready for bad things happening."

Reading some of the reporting from around this dude's residence, it seems no one ever engaged this guy in any social interaction, it was all "he's fucked up, say Hi and avoid him." That isolation can't have been beneficial. S/F....Ken M
__________________
"If you remember nothing else about what Iím about to consider here, remember this: the one and only reason politicians, bureaucrats, and policemen want to take your weapons away from you is so that they can do things to you that they couldnít do if you still had your weapons."ó L. Neil Smith
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 10 November 2018, 12:13
DCH's Avatar
DCH DCH is offline
Callsign: Turkey Bacon
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: SoCAL
Posts: 2,263
I’ve looked, not one “former” “ex” “once a..” whatever Marine who went rogue with a bloodlust against innocent civilians (in peacetime) ever blamed their time in boot camp or the Marines for their own actions.

Open to refutation..
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 10 November 2018, 13:30
CAVmedic CAVmedic is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Mid West
Posts: 1,324
Quote:
Originally Posted by EchoFiveMike View Post
...Reading some of the reporting from around this dude's residence, it seems no one ever engaged this guy in any social interaction, it was all "he's fucked up, say Hi and avoid him." That isolation can't have been beneficial. S/F....Ken M
I can def. see that going on with a lot of combat service members. Not just the difference in interests and mentality than the majority of society, but the look and posture gets you shunned.

Coming off active, made the huge mistake of thinking I might want to be a nurse (I didn't), joined a reserve CSH unit and had hardly anything in common with 90% of the sissy boys there. Was married at the time and left the women alone. Made a few "friends" but mostly kept to myself and stayed quiet. I got upset a few times at whatever, let my true colors show a couple times and viola "That guy's crazy", "He's got PTSD!"...

Having combat service can possibly make you a pariah, and having any temper afterwards warrants a PTSD diagnosis from the baracks Dr's. Now this is a shitty thing to have happen, and I know it sucked for me.

This guy was murderer plain and simple. Wanting to go around punching dickheads is far removed from wanting to shoot up the mall. I just can't identify with that one. Surely most here can't either.
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 10 November 2018, 19:13
KimberChick's Avatar
KimberChick KimberChick is offline
At the Barn
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Virginia
Posts: 1,194
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVmedic View Post
I can def. see that going on with a lot of combat service members. Not just the difference in interests and mentality than the majority of society, but the look and posture gets you shunned.

Coming off active, made the huge mistake of thinking I might want to be a nurse (I didn't), joined a reserve CSH unit and had hardly anything in common with 90% of the sissy boys there. Was married at the time and left the women alone. Made a few "friends" but mostly kept to myself and stayed quiet. I got upset a few times at whatever, let my true colors show a couple times and viola "That guy's crazy", "He's got PTSD!"...

Having combat service can possibly make you a pariah, and having any temper afterwards warrants a PTSD diagnosis from the baracks Dr's. Now this is a shitty thing to have happen, and I know it sucked for me.

This guy was murderer plain and simple. Wanting to go around punching dickheads is far removed from wanting to shoot up the mall. I just can't identify with that one. Surely most here can't either.
He had behavioral problems long before he joined the service. Lost his dad to liver failure at age 9, so raised by his mother ever since. There is definitely something that went south in that man a long time ago and it wasn't the Marine Corps.
__________________
"I heard you've been talking shit, you tab-less bitch." - KS11
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Our new posting rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 20:03.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Socnet.com All Rights Reserved
© SOCNET 1996-2018