Glock 10mms?

[EchoFiveMike]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet

Yes.

Before you go and buy a 1911 10 MM, cover some of the reading that I covered....the Glocks are the only mass-produced guns other than the Brens that are designed to carry the cartridge pressure from the ground up. The 1911 variants are all considered retrofitted.

S&W M610

Nice guns, quality work.

PDW against bears? How about a 45/70 carbine or maybe a shottie with Brennekes? Pistols? May as well issue magical talismans if all you're trying to do is make people feel safer. S/F....Ken M

[The Fat Guy]

Many people I know that hunt bear carry a 44 mag or similarly capable hand gun. While 155 grn at 1400 is no 44 MAG, a 10mm carries far more than 6 shots.

[EchoFiveMike]

Hunting allows passing up bad shots, defending vs bear OTOH is going to be a bit exciting.

I'd use 180's or 200's vs bear, in 10mm. Or maybe hard cast ogival flatpoints. S/F....Ken M

[Nimja]

This might wet your appetite... He tests three manufacturers stated velocities out of four bullet weights. All are the hard cast lead variety with a G20 (SF?) with a 6" barrel and a nicely done RDS.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31qdRkT7058

[GPC]

Originally Posted by bobofthedesert

I seem to recall reading somewhere that the Danish Army issues Glock 10mm's to their folks who work in the Arctic as a PDW against polar bears. Much as I like my Delta Elite I have to admit if I was in their shoes, in that environment and with that threat I would want a G20 SF also.

Long time ago I worked the rail line up to Churchill Manitoba.
During Polar Bear season when they pretty much take the town over.I owned a .338 Win Mag and felt I would be under gunned against a Polar Bear.I wouldn't go with anything less than a .375 H&H for a PDW.
I do know that Robert E Petersen took a male at 25 yards with a M29 in the 60s.That is some brass balls in my book.

[bobofthedesert]

Originally Posted by EchoFiveMike

PDW against bears? How about a 45/70 carbine or maybe a shottie with Brennekes? Pistols? May as well issue magical talismans if all you're trying to do is make people feel safer. S/F....Ken M

I'm sure they have large caliber rifles as well. But as we all know, the advantage of a handgun is convenience, right there on the belt, all the time.

Polar bears are some stealthy MF'ers. That rifle might not be within arms reach at all times. I wouldn't be walking around with just a pistol either, but I wouldn't mind having it. And 10mm is nothing to sneeze at, more energy at 100 yards than a .45 at the muzzle. Glock reliability and 15 rounds would work more for me in an arctic field environment, in and out of heated/subzero all the time, condensation, etc., than a .44 mag revolver.

[GPC]

Originally Posted by bobofthedesert

I'm sure they have large caliber rifles as well. But as we all know, the advantage of a handgun is convenience, right there on the belt, all the time.

Polar bears are some stealthy MF'ers. That rifle might not be within arms reach at all times. I wouldn't be walking around with just a pistol either, but I wouldn't mind having it. And 10mm is nothing to sneeze at, more energy at 100 yards than a .45 at the muzzle. Glock reliability and 15 rounds would work more for me in an arctic field environment, in and out of heated/subzero all the time, condensation, etc., than a .44 mag revolver.

I have had a few run ins in my AO with Black bears as of late.
One night woke up and one was outside my window. And was ready to empty my G34 into him if it came to that.Another time was longboarding and had the same bear walk in front of me.And 3 weeks ago was walking my property and ran into him again this time I had a 1911 lucky for bear he went other way.Hence why I have a interest in 10mm for a house/woods gun.I don't mind lugging a 6.5" M29 in the woods but 15 rds of 10mm sounds good in my book.

Have any members ever taken a black bear with a 10mm?
I should get a Socnet bear hunt going to solve my bear problem.Methinks his den is near my house.

[Nimja]

Are you in eastern NC????? .....or NH? When I got really into learning about the 10mm, there are a couple of stories on the Interwebs about guides, Glocks, and grizzlies... Apparently shot placement still reigns supreme. There is a known game warden that put down some large bears with a .357 by shooting them in the spine. This is my motivation... (it isn't mine though....)

[GPC]

Originally Posted by Nimja

Are you in eastern NC????? .....or NH? When I got really into learning about the 10mm, there are a couple of stories on the Interwebs about guides, Glocks, and grizzlies... Apparently shot placement still reigns supreme. There is a known game warden that put down some large bears with a .357 by shooting them in the spine. This is my motivation... (it isn't mine though....)

NH, .357 Mag or Sig?I would feel confident using a .357 mag on a black bear as long as have a few speed loaders.

Nice pic I wouldn't mind adding it to collection.

[Nimja]

.357 mag. I forgot to add (for the 10mm) that when the grizzly rose up on its hind legs and growled, he shot twice through the mouth and busted the spine. I'm trying to find it again, but this was years ago...

[SOTB]

Originally Posted by bobofthedesert

Polar bears are some stealthy MF'ers. That rifle might not be within arms reach at all times....

And therein lies the problem. This is a simple issue of SA and inability to have it/use it. No, I do not care -- in the slightest -- that there are supposedly moments when it is too difficult to have your rifle on you. For those people, you get to be lunch -- sadly, your willingness to be chow means that bear might believe through other peoples' errors that I'm chow, too. Well, whatever -- it would likely suck, but in that environment -- if I'm allowed to carry at all, the bear would be eating large-caliber rifle rounds right up to the point where the rifle simply became a club....

[Scotty]

I love my Delta Elite, it's never failed to go bang and I've done some IDPA with it. Warning to all, if you do try and convert, get a barrel FITTED. I tried the "drop in" KSG Firedragon and it wasn't so drop in, the minute spacing differential was knocking my slide lock back and forth. I was lucky to not have damaged the weapon irreparably. I've not shot the Glock, but would definitely give it a whirl.

[Scotty]

PS - when you send that barrel BACK to KSG Firedragon they will keep it and still not refund you. :)

[Blackjack78]

Originally Posted by SOTB

And therein lies the problem. This is a simple issue of SA and inability to have it/use it. No, I do not care -- in the slightest -- that there are supposedly moments when it is too difficult to have your rifle on you. For those people, you get to be lunch -- sadly, your willingness to be chow means that bear might believe through other peoples' errors that I'm chow, too. Well, whatever -- it would likely suck, but in that environment -- if I'm allowed to carry at all, the bear would be eating large-caliber rifle rounds right up to the point where the rifle simply became a club....

Meh :). I was there for this, I told them 38spl was a good round just not for bear. Said bear gave zero indication of being hit by the handgun rounds. Watching a kid,it's all about the children, being devoured in front of you is memorable.This was one for the books. The problem was, well aside from the boys death, the fight over the skins.
http://www.nytimes.com/1987/05/20/nyregion/polar-bears-kill-a-child-at-prospect-park-zoo.html

[bobofthedesert]

Originally Posted by SOTB

And therein lies the problem. This is a simple issue of SA and inability to have it/use it. No, I do not care -- in the slightest -- that there are supposedly moments when it is too difficult to have your rifle on you. For those people, you get to be lunch -- sadly, your willingness to be chow means that bear might believe through other peoples' errors that I'm chow, too. Well, whatever -- it would likely suck, but in that environment -- if I'm allowed to carry at all, the bear would be eating large-caliber rifle rounds right up to the point where the rifle simply became a club....

I do not disagree in the slightest. But large caliber handguns, often .44 magnum revolvers, are favored by folks in bear country (such as Alaska) for good reason.

[EchoFiveMike]

IME. bullet design is important. For large American things that eat you, penetration is critical.

I once was confronted by a black bear while turkey hunting on CLNC. The blackies there get pretty huge eating MRE's from the dumpsters. Like "super bears", if you will, with constipation. And they associate human smells with food....not good.

Anyhow I was sitting by my tree all cammied up, with my Mossberg 500stuffed with 3" turkey loads when Mr Bear comes sniffing up. I sat tight, hoping he'd go away, when he spotted/smelled me at about 8yds. Things were a little "interesting" as we looked at each other for about 100yrs, then I got an idea, and rose up and yelled at him, and he ran off. Good for me. I'm pretty sure 2oz of #4 at 5yds would have blown the bear's face/eyes off completely, but I do think said critter would have got his paws on me anyways, and that would have been "bad." S/F.....Ken M

[bobofthedesert]

Originally Posted by EchoFiveMike

IME. bullet design is important. For large American things that eat you, penetration is critical.

Found the following on another board, in a similar thread......apparently the folks in Alaska know about the 10mm also.....

".......the 10mm will out penetrate anything else commonly made for a service auto by a fair margin. I witnessed a 65" moose take 3 in the vitals at 25 yards. He went down in 15 seconds or so and all three rounds were recovered from 1-4" from the other side.

A very considerable share of 10mm ammo and handguns are sold here in Alaska; far more than any other state. 10mm is what I recommend to outdoorsmen who are looking for a handgun for defensive use. 44's of comparable size are much harder and far more unpleasant to shoot and except for the Taurus Tracker/Ruger Blackhawk, the Glock is 30% cheaper. I give a 5 second/3 hit test to students on a charging target all the time and the vast majority don't pass with a 44. Most can get 4-6 hits with a Glock 20."

[Nimja]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUG8UPsgE3U

1:42 is where a good scene of the action starts. The charge is almost(?) 2 secs long. They got lucky. I don't know if the "round into the water" was "planned" or more likely a miss. It looks like he thumb cocks the revolver, as you see his hand move to center line, then pushes out and fires. I think with a reliable semiauto in 10mm or 460 Rowland you could get off maybe 1-2 more shots and potentially affect the bear further out...

But yes, bear cubs? Rifle! (Maybe a big bore AR????)

[glockcqc]

1 of my G29s and chrono'd 200gr XTP hand loaded defense/hunting rounds.

I use KKM barrels & wolff guide rods/extra power recoil & striker springs.

Good shooting

[glockcqc]

My hunting G20 10mm

Good shooting