SOCNET

Go Back   SOCNET: The Special Operations Community Network > General Topics > The Lounge

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 8 July 2018, 15:18
Jim1348 Jim1348 is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: US
Posts: 155
Conscription In The United States

A friend of mine, who was in the United States Navy, posted on Facebook that he would love to see conscription brought back to the United States.

What do people here think about that?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 8 July 2018, 15:25
Mingo Kane's Avatar
Mingo Kane Mingo Kane is online now
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Virginia
Posts: 3,667
Good luck with that notion....
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 8 July 2018, 15:50
Gsniper Gsniper is online now
Shakin' the bush Boss
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 5,984
I don't see any future in it as long as we can meet needed troop levels thru volunteers. WW3, maybe.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 8 July 2018, 15:54
Dangerous's Avatar
Dangerous Dangerous is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Tampa, FL
Posts: 1,256
But, but, but some European countries are stating it again.

We don’t need it, although I’d like to see some of the handwringers made to serve.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 8 July 2018, 15:55
leopardprey's Avatar
leopardprey leopardprey is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 12,164
Never happen. And don't really think it is a good idea.

What would be good is maybe tie in some rights of citizenship to serving. Probably not happen, but make it where one has to "earn" the full rights of citizenship - the right to vote, the right to own a firearm, etc. allow other paths besides just the military - peace corps, conservation corps, volunteer work at a nursing home or mental institute (had an uncle who was a concientious objector who did this as alternative service for a couple of years when he was drafted), teacher at an inner-city school, work with mentally handicapped youth, volunteer firefighter, police officer, etc. some sort of community service.

Could also be used as a path to citizenship for the " Dreamers" (DACA) kids or other immigrants who want to become US citizens.

Also no SNAP benefits, housing allowances without some sort of past service in ones record, or a requirement to do some sort of service if getting benefits. "Ok, here is your snap card, but in exchange you have to do two hours of trash pick up a day at the local park".
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"Look Sharp, Act Sharp, Be Sharp - But don't cut yourself!"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 8 July 2018, 15:56
Dogwelder Dogwelder is offline
Confirmed User
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: CONUS
Posts: 223
Before that conversation can really move forward, you’re gonna have to get the country to agree on what constitutes a “citizen”. Since apparently the concept of citizenship is xenophobic by today’s standard, I don’t see that happening anytime soon. Plus never mind the pros and cons of compelled service.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 8 July 2018, 15:57
Gsniper Gsniper is online now
Shakin' the bush Boss
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Virginia
Posts: 5,984
Plus, as a professional soldier, the though of a platoon full of conscripts makes me break out in hives. Regular Joes are stupid enough, and they volunteered.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:00
leopardprey's Avatar
leopardprey leopardprey is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 12,164
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gsniper View Post
Plus, as a professional soldier, the though of a platoon full of conscripts makes me break out in hives. Regular Joes are stupid enough, and they volunteered.
Can you imagine the bitching/complain factor? You thought listening to soldiers bitch and complain now was bad.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"Look Sharp, Act Sharp, Be Sharp - But don't cut yourself!"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:01
Gray Rhyno's Avatar
Gray Rhyno Gray Rhyno is offline
Authorized Personnel
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: NoVa
Posts: 9,563
Quote:
Originally Posted by leopardprey View Post
allow other paths besides just the military...some sort of community service.
I like this idea, except I don't think the individual should get to choose how they serve. Like Heinlein, an individual just gets to volunteer; society decides if they are an intercity teacher or or Mobile Infantry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gsniper View Post
Plus, as a professional soldier, the though of a platoon full of conscripts makes me break out in hives. Regular Joes are stupid enough, and they volunteered.
Can you imagine having a David Hogg in your platoon? That guy'd be a major pain in the ass.
__________________
"The most HSLD stuff ever taught was the basics. So-called 'advanced training' is often no more than the very fluid and expert application of those basic skills." - SOTB
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:01
leopardprey's Avatar
leopardprey leopardprey is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 12,164
Mobile infantry less stressful and less dangerous.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"Look Sharp, Act Sharp, Be Sharp - But don't cut yourself!"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:08
ramzmedic's Avatar
ramzmedic ramzmedic is offline
I really don't care
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Hastings, MN
Posts: 1,629
If it was ever reinstated it should include the gals, too.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:18
leopardprey's Avatar
leopardprey leopardprey is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 12,164
Women say they want equality - then make it 50% of those conscripted to be sent into battle must be women.

We should also work to eliminate the injustice in work place deaths, since men account for 95% of those deaths. Let's get more women into the more risky professions (linepersons, fisherpersons, policepersons, infantrypersons, construction workers, etc) and get some equality where women make up 50% of all workplace deaths.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"Look Sharp, Act Sharp, Be Sharp - But don't cut yourself!"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by leopardprey; 8 July 2018 at 16:43.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:35
havok88 havok88 is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: US
Posts: 1,993
There are a LOT of people in this country that I would not want to work with in any job, especially in the military where I could potentially have to go to war with them.

As far as the whole women thing, I would only agree if they are a confirmed feminist, and can be put into a unit full of feminist women who will be kept out of the way of everything that matters. If I had a daughter, I would never wish for her to be drafted, and to have to serve in an infantry unit.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:52
litepath's Avatar
litepath litepath is offline
I reckon so. . .
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ga.
Posts: 2,790
Gen'l Sherman was not impressed with conscripts according to his memoir.

There is current data that says we have about 30% of our youth who are even eligible to serve. The others are unable due to obesity, drugs/crime, and stoopid.
__________________
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for nature cannot be fooled." Richard Feynman, Rogers Commission;personal appendix.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:55
DirtyDog0311 DirtyDog0311 is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: South
Posts: 7,385
Everyone initially thinks this is a good idea. It's not until you start really start taking this idea to it's end state that its clear it's actually really a BAD idea.

Bad for the military in general. Bad for the good people that actually want to be in the military. Bad for the nation because now your mil units are full of fucking idiots and pieces of shit that don't want to be there. Bad for the citizenry because with that large of a pipe diameter, you're bound to get legions of shitbags that fall through the cracks and are now "veterans" (complete with all those earned bennies), yet learned absolutely NOTHING during their time in --- except how to be even bigger shitbags. The national body politic that currently masquerades as the nation historically known as the USA is not in any way equipped to have conscription be a success. At least with the voluntary forces you can set standards. Maintaining those standards in the face of PC subversion is another story.

As far as women conscripted into the direct combat roles? Yeah, sounds like a great way to lose a war.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 8 July 2018, 16:55
Stretch Stretch is offline
The atomic zit
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Capital of the Old North State
Posts: 3,593
I once thought conscription was worth considering...

A member, previously known as South of the Border, quickly squared me away; as did other prior service members.

I will read along to see if opinions have changed.

v/r

S
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 8 July 2018, 17:07
Ole crusty bastard's Avatar
Ole crusty bastard Ole crusty bastard is offline
Authorized Personnel
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Port Charlotte FL
Posts: 4,951
The draftees I knew were a not a happy/productive group. If it were not for the RA guys holding/forcing their hands, we would of been screwed. I can't see how that would be different today.
__________________
...when in doubt...over prime.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 8 July 2018, 17:25
btq96r's Avatar
btq96r btq96r is offline
Calix Meus Inebrians
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Improving my Foxhole
Posts: 3,323
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gsniper View Post
Plus, as a professional soldier, the though of a platoon full of conscripts makes me break out in hives. Regular Joes are stupid enough, and they volunteered.
I remember when we had to deal with the combo punch of stop loss soldiers, and people who came in on "moral waivers" during the height of OIF. I can only imagine how much worse it would be with draftees from the current 18-25yr old population.

While I get that a large war might necessitate it, I'd want to see the guard and reserves called out in full before it's actions in any form. Conscription sounds like a good concept when discussing the greater principles of citizenship, and for think tanks who want to see a larger end strength to the military...but it's not something I'd imagine any NCO or officer responsible for training and leading those troops ever wants to have forced upon them.
__________________
Moderation is for Canadians.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 8 July 2018, 17:43
leopardprey's Avatar
leopardprey leopardprey is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Indiana
Posts: 12,164
I think for smaller countries, like Singapore and Israel and a few other places, it works much better. Dare I say that those nations, the citizens also as a whole have a more solid foundation of patriotism, service and maybe overall better educational levels.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
"Look Sharp, Act Sharp, Be Sharp - But don't cut yourself!"
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 8 July 2018, 18:03
AKAPete AKAPete is offline
Been There Done That
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Posts: 1,561
Draft for the military and national service - the left's wet dream.

The left dreams of their glory days of burning draft cards, protests in the streets, etc.

National service? The left slobbers over the idea of paid snowflakes for two years. Think of all the instant protesters every week for the protest of the hour.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Our new posting rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 19:47.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Socnet.com All Rights Reserved
© SOCNET 1996-2018