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  #121  
Old 14 July 2018, 07:46
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If you're doing standard DL for strength, you're doing way too little volume and your sets seem random. There is no need to go above 5 reps and you may want research ramping. Also what upper back work are you doing?

While a standard DL can be taxing on your CNS, other variations can and should be used more frequently especially RDL's. Additional non spinal load work can be done numerous times a week as well- KB swings, glute ham raises and back extensions. All of these are supporting and complentary work for the DL and life in general.
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  #122  
Old 14 July 2018, 09:06
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^ Yup. Add the Glute-Ham Raise too (you'll probably need a band assist if you've never done them - humbling exercise).

If you don't have a specific GHR at your gym/home, you can do what I do if you have a Power Rack: Put the J-Hooks in the very bottom hole, place a bar across, load a bunch of 25s/35s on each end, and put a "pussy pad" on the bar. You should be able to wedge your Achilles under there and be off to the races. Wrap a band around the front Pullup bar if needed.
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  #123  
Old 14 July 2018, 09:12
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Originally Posted by mike76233 View Post
Thank you for the response. I'm deadlifting purely for strength reasons. I'll keep doing it once a week. I'll look back and find the loading patterns you posted and take it from there. Much appreciated.
Here:

http://www.socnet.com/showpost.php?p...77&postcount=1

If you don't have a true 1RM, there are calculators online that can estimate from 3, 5, etc.. RMs and get you close. If you complete everything and it's too easy - add weight, if you can't complete (WITH GOOD FORM (no breakdown)) - reduce weight.
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  #124  
Old 14 July 2018, 10:53
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Outstanding thread and topic! Wish I would have paid attention a little sooner.
Went for yearly physical May 1st. Doc calls me May 3. Blood work is back, everything looks good except A1C is 6.6, I had crossed the line, barely but still over it, to type 2 diabetes. Very few people would call me fat, I was 6'5" 233lbs with a 38 waist. My food groups the past decade or so were; breakfast, whatever the 2 for $3 biscuit deal at Hardee's is. Lunch, 2 items off the dollar menu at some fast food restaurant, supper, my wife is Italian and a great cook. Throw dessert in 4-5 times a week plus a milkshake or 2 per week in the summer and you get the picture. About the only good habit I had was the only thing I drank for the past several years was water and unsweetened tea.
I've got a small construction company and am in the truck constantly checking on jobs. I thought I felt good, didn't consider myself overweight so it was easy to rationalize.
Went into immeadiate action to reverse it. 2 plans of action, diet and exercise. For exercise I began a 6 day per week minimum 45 minutes of light to moderate exercise, light weights x high reps combined with 1-2 mile what I call runs, more accurately trudges. Diet I became fanatical about. As soon as I began it became much easier than I thought it would be. Cut out all traditional bread, anything with more than 3g added sugars per serving, processed foods as best I can. Basically if it has more than a couple of ingredients and I don't know what they are I won't eat it.
What I do eat is a lot of vegetables, fruit, eggs, some meat, and ancient grain breads or wraps.
The results have been dramatic. Within 2-3 days I started feeling noticeably better than what I previously thought was good. Within a week I felt so much better the foods I used to love so much were no longer a temptation. The weight started pouring off me at a rate of 2-3 lbs per week. I started sleeping better. The brain fog that comes from processed foods disappeared.
10 weeks in July 10, I had another A1C test and follow up with doc. He said it had been a long time since he had seen someone actually follow through on something like this.
Weight 193lbs, that's down 40lbs
A1C 5.8, the very bottom of the pre diabetes scale. Currently I'm classified as a diet dependent type 2 diabetic.

If you are on the same path I was on, read what Polypro and others are saying on here and make some changes. I am 53 years old and feel better physically and mentally than I have in decades. Pay attention to this stuff before it gets out of hand. I believed the changes would be difficult, they actually have become quite addictive.

Poly I know you believe in the benefits of heavy lifting. I took bullets through both my shoulders and the structural damage doesn't allow that for me in upper body exercises. What do you recommend as an alternative?

Thank you for creating this thread!!
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  #125  
Old 14 July 2018, 11:28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pondwater View Post
The results have been dramatic. Within 2-3 days I started feeling noticeably better than what I previously thought was good. Within a week I felt so much better the foods I used to love so much were no longer a temptation. The weight started pouring off me at a rate of 2-3 lbs per week. I started sleeping better. The brain fog that comes from processed foods disappeared.

I believed the changes would be difficult, they actually have become quite addictive.

Poly I know you believe in the benefits of heavy lifting. I took bullets through both my shoulders and the structural damage doesn't allow that for me in upper body exercises. What do you recommend as an alternative?

Thank you for creating this thread!!
Pretty f'n awesome, isn't it? Everyone thinks there's some sort of "new", magic, secret and a pill or powder... NOPE just shop around the perimeter of the grocery store and do *something* for at least an hour a day.

You can only do what you can physically do - take whatever as high as you can without pain, obviously. Look into a weighted Hip Belt for Squatting - you load it up and step up onto (for example) two benches and do squats. KB Swings (and you can make your own "swinger" for Olympic Plates for about $12 in the Plumbing Section at Lowes) shouldn't bother your shoulders in the traditional Posterior Chain swing - just don't try to turn it into a shoulder exercise.

Check here for exercises you can do involving shoulders (if any):

https://exrx.net/Lists/Directory

You can use that belt for Dips too, which will hit the Pecs. Chest supported DB Rows (Aka a 'SEAL Row') for the back may not hurt the shoulders? Just gotta trial and error.

Resistance training is the #1 best thing you can do for Insulin Sensitivity - Metformin is a last resort IMO

NICE JOB, BUD!!!
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  #126  
Old 14 July 2018, 11:30
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61 yrs old. get paid for my sweat. Still pouring concrete. Own 4 properties to pour sweat equity into. Swim in the river. 6ft 4 and 215 .
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  #127  
Old 14 July 2018, 11:48
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I took Poly's advise and got serious about counting calories and it's working like a champ. I'm eating a lot of food and not being hungry and burning about 500 cals a day with a workout. I'm dropping about 3lb per week with about another 15lb to go. I'm still slightly limited from my back surgeries in May, but I'm getting stronger by the day.

Didn't take long to identify where my bad cals were coming from and eliminate those items.
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  #128  
Old 15 July 2018, 14:46
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Originally Posted by Gsniper View Post
I took Poly's advise and got serious about counting calories and it's working like a champ. I'm dropping about 3lb per week with about another 15lb to go.
Awesome!
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  #129  
Old 15 July 2018, 17:18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
Pretty f'n awesome, isn't it? Everyone thinks there's some sort of "new", magic, secret and a pill or powder... NOPE just shop around the perimeter of the grocery store and do *something* for at least an hour a day.

Check here for exercises you can do involving shoulders (if any):

https://exrx.net/Lists/Directory

You can use that belt for Dips too, which will hit the Pecs. Chest supported DB Rows (Aka a 'SEAL Row') for the back may not hurt the shoulders? Just gotta trial and error.

Resistance training is the #1 best thing you can do for Insulin Sensitivity - Metformin is a last resort IMO
Thank you!!
There is a lot of truth in that first statement.
I will look into the belt and kb's. I hadn't even considered dips but that is an exercise I can do. I've got the standard 25 y/o weider 300 lb Olympic set combination bench and squat rack and have ordered some resistance bands.

I did not know that about resistance training and insulin so will definitely focus more in that area. I took the Metformin for about a month but got off it as soon as diet and exercise got the blood sugar under control. Doc surprised me by being fine with that.
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  #130  
Old 15 July 2018, 19:42
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Polypro,
First of all, thanks for this thread and the advice you’re giving both in the thread and PM’s.
Back in the beginning of this thread I was Testosterone deficient, about 258lb. high blood pressure and basically turning into a tub of lard. This was February of this year. I am now 223lbs. Testosterone levels are in the 750 range using .75ml injections every 7th day. Diet changes and counting calories have been with great results. I have been wasting money on the BCAA’s come to find.
My workouts consist of swimming 1.1 mile 4-6 times a week. Circuit training whole body for 45-50 minutes 3-4 times a week and transport for 25-40 minutes 5-7 times per week. I reached 223 in late June and have plateaued. Waistline has shrunk 5 inches and my old T-shirt’s fit in the right places.
My question concerns weight plateaus. I am frustrated with no weight loss since late June. I am normally calorie deficit everyday. Protein/fat/carb ratios are being tweaked to be about a 3:2:1 ratio respectively. I have heard a fast breaks through plateaus but fasting makes for shitty workouts. Any better method recommendations?
Thanks again
Xenon
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  #131  
Old 15 July 2018, 19:58
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Be cautious of focusing too much on weight loss plateaus. You may be stalled due to body comp changes- ie, muscle gain.
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  #132  
Old 15 July 2018, 20:09
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Originally Posted by Silverbullet View Post
Be cautious of focusing too much on weight loss plateaus. You may be stalled due to body comp changes- ie, muscle gain.
Excellent point SB. Thanks
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  #133  
Old 16 July 2018, 05:22
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Originally Posted by Xenonburnout View Post

A. Testosterone levels are in the 750 range using .75ml injections every 7th day.

B.My question concerns weight plateaus. I am frustrated with no weight loss since late June. I am normally calorie deficit everyday.

C.I have heard a fast breaks through plateaus but fasting makes for shitty workouts.

Any better method recommendations?
A. Congrats on getting the HRT dialed in - pretty fricken sweet, huh? Just some observations you may look at (but if it ain't broke... may apply as well )

If you are doing the injections yourself, I assume you are using 200mg/ml Testosterone Cypionate? Which at 0.75ml/wk would be 150mg/wk? You may get even better results splitting your injection in half (0.38ml) and injecting Mon AM and Thurs PM (you would then split your AI ((if any)) dose in half as well). This would keep the levels more stable throughout the week. Are you doing SubQ injections into fat, or IM into muscle? SubQ is soooo much more user friendly. Is your Doc an HRT specialist, or a "regular" one? If the former, I'd see about getting the levels up a bit more - even if he/she doesn't want to go above the (BS) Labcorp/Quest max (916ng/dl) you have room. What were your Free Test, Estrogen, and SHBG numbers? Did you discuss HCG with him/her?

B. First off, don't look at weight, except in a very general sense now - you now have normal Testosterone levels and that will put on (muscle) weight, and you are now resistance training (more muscle weight). Get a fat caliper and a good cloth tape measure and start recording those. I'd only get on a scale once every 2 weeks. As long as the caliper and tape are getting smaller = winning. Also, like SB said above, depending on how long you've been in a deficit - you may need a diet break. Fat loss is basically mild starvation - not what the human body likes to do - and it will compensate metabolically (gotta make it through that famine ) My advice would be to go back up to maintenance level calories for at least 2 weeks. You'll gain some water weight due to more carbohydrates pulling in more water with the glycogen (~3:1 water to glycogen) - but it won't be fat unless you *really* over-estimate what your maint. level is. Go look at the data on a Fat Loss study called 'MATADOR' - some good info. They found a 2 week deficit, followed by 2 weeks at maint. led to double the fat loss IIRC. It minimized down-regulation and kept Leptin higher. A good middle ground would be 11 On (deficit)/3 Off (Maint.) for a nice and neat 14 day cycle.

C. Don't believe all the hype about fasting. Yes, there are some positive things that happen with zero energy coming in (ie. true starvation) - Growth hormone output increases, and Cellular Autophagy (body house cleaning) goes up as well. But I wouldn't do it as a fat loss strategy. NOW - what you *can* try, and this will depend on how you respond personally - is what is called 'Intermittent Fasting' on a 16/8 schedule. You kind of get the benefits of fasting listed above, but you are still taking in your daily energy limit - just in a compressed manner. An example would be having your last meal at 7PM, and not having your next one until 11 AM. It's really more of a hunger control tool (if it works for you). I do it because I'm absolutely NOT even the slightest bit hungry until around Noon - then instead of a bunch of smaller meals every few hours, I get 3 bigger ones. I like it, but it's not the magic that you'll see on the interwebs. Fasted training is stoopid - find a Gold Medal winner that did it?
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  #134  
Old 16 July 2018, 05:41
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Here's the MATADOR study - full FT via Nature:

https://www.nature.com/articles/ijo2017206

The one caveat is that lean'ish men who train, aren't obese men as in the study, but it's a small nit for this IMO.
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  #135  
Old 18 July 2018, 15:46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silverbullet View Post
If you're doing standard DL for strength, you're doing way too little volume and your sets seem random. There is no need to go above 5 reps and you may want research ramping. Also what upper back work are you doing?

While a standard DL can be taxing on your CNS, other variations can and should be used more frequently especially RDL's. Additional non spinal load work can be done numerous times a week as well- KB swings, glute ham raises and back extensions. All of these are supporting and complentary work for the DL and life in general.
Thanks SB. Im going to increase the volume to a point where I can do no more than 5 reps my first set. As far as back exercises, Im doing the bent over barbell row, the 1 arm dumbell row and the seated cable row at the moment as well as pull ups a couple times a week. I'll check out those other exercises you mentioned as well as throwing in a set or 2 of RDL's a week. Much appreciated.
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  #136  
Old 18 July 2018, 15:50
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Originally Posted by Polypro View Post
^ Yup. Add the Glute-Ham Raise too (you'll probably need a band assist if you've never done them - humbling exercise).

If you don't have a specific GHR at your gym/home, you can do what I do if you have a Power Rack: Put the J-Hooks in the very bottom hole, place a bar across, load a bunch of 25s/35s on each end, and put a "pussy pad" on the bar. You should be able to wedge your Achilles under there and be off to the races. Wrap a band around the front Pullup bar if needed.
Thanks for the loading patterns link and the glute ham raise recommendation. I don't yet have a Power Rack so I am stuck going to the gym at the moment. I'll youtube the exercise to get a good idea of the form. Appreciate the help.
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  #137  
Old 19 July 2018, 07:59
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Originally Posted by mike76233 View Post
Thanks for the loading patterns link and the glute ham raise recommendation. I don't yet have a Power Rack so I am stuck going to the gym at the moment. I'll youtube the exercise to get a good idea of the form. Appreciate the help.
Those Loading Patterns actually are old as dirt - back in the 70's there was a magazine called 'Powerlifting USA' - they appeared in there. I'm having great success with them. Check and see if the gym has an actual GHR - looks kind of like a Hyper Extension

https://www.titan.fitness/glute-hams...developer.html
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  #138  
Old 19 July 2018, 09:03
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Poly - question/thoughts?

So I've been lifting free weights, old fashion style. Bench, curl, dips, tri's, etc... on off days I do more of a crossfit style workout. I also do standard situps, pushups, pullups, etc..

So the debate: I was telling a pal that doing the old school weights and workout is fucking awesome. I can definitely see some gains BUT even cooler is it's such a throw back to days of badassery.

His response: Yeah, I can get the same from just doing pushups.

I said, I didn't mean this to be a debate simply that I'm enjoying old school workouts BUT you're full of shit. You can't get the same gains from just doing pushups.

What say you fuckers???

(always get yo gains!!! LMAO)
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  #139  
Old 19 July 2018, 09:07
Gsniper Gsniper is offline
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I do a convict style workout with a lot of body weight stuff and a treadmill session. It's working like a champ for me, but I'm not trying to bulk up, just trim down and get stronger.

I wish it was as easy as just doing some pushups. If that was true I'd have looked like Schwarzenegger when I was a private.
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  #140  
Old 19 July 2018, 09:27
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Originally Posted by Gsniper View Post
I do a convict style workout with a lot of body weight stuff and a treadmill session. It's working like a champ for me, but I'm not trying to bulk up, just trim down and get stronger.

I wish it was as easy as just doing some pushups. If that was true I'd have looked like Schwarzenegger when I was a private.
Yeah I do bike trainer for usually 40-60 mins and then weights. I also do a shit ton of pushups...

I'm not saying just pushups wouldn't give you gains, but it's going to be a different kind and a different time period IMHO.
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